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Hey, Joe: An Open Letter to Joe Turner and SOS

by Chicomozteca Tuesday, Aug. 02, 2005 at 1:06 AM

Joe Turner of "Save our State" has a "new" strategy." One that will lead to the same old tragedy, based as it is on the premises of ethnic cleansing and a resort to Storm Trooper style violence. More below.

Hey Joe;

You say nelow that two things can destroy your organization – initiating violence and associating with Nazis.

Your answer to the problems you face?

Initiate violence.


It’s so striking. Months ago now Andy Ramirez, that traitor to his people, wrote of you "You don't incite violence. It's racist crap. Emotions are hot to begin with. What he says is insensitive, disrespectful and racist. It's neo-Nazi thuggery. What's next, the sheet and hood?"

Seems that way, doesn’t it?

And, actually, disassociating yourself from white supremacists will be impossible, since you are one, and since the open Nazis are your most natural allies.

Oh, you’re Not a white supremacist, you say?

Then what’s this?

Americans, you say, “are tired of watching their great American culture disappear, only to watch it be replaced by other cultures that are inferior and contradictory to everything this country was built upon.”

A headline on your website reads “Aren't you tired of watching your state turn into a third world cesspool right before your eyes?”

Your website is riddled with racist images and fiercely racist stereotypes of the Mexican people.

I don’t need to belabor the obvious – a number of people have researched and documented the ideological and rhetorical identity between yourself and your organization, on one hand, and white supremacist organizations on the other – and of course, the personal ties and relationships have been noted as well, repeatedly.

As if that weren’t enough, you make it very plain that your agenda is race war when you write, “Many suggest that violence is coming to California. Many suggest that a civil war of sorts may be on the horizon.”

It is inevitable that with that outlook your only recourse now is to create more violence – your outlook demands it, yearns for it, embraces it and works toward it. Haven’t you noticed that you’re always “seething with anger” as you yourself put it?

It is bitterly amusing to watch you whine that the police don’t protect you – what small town pig would ever protect you, after you declared war on the little town of Baldwin Park?


You put yourself in the position you’re in, you’re not a “victim,” much less are you “oppressed.” No one is sabotaging you but you, yourself. YOU ARE the problem.

You blame the Laguna Beach Police Department, saying they “may have sought to foster such an environment so that we can be tied to these White Supremacists and thus lead to our organiztion being discredited or marginalized.”


It wasn’t the PIGS who brought the Nazis along, who demonstrated with them in Baldwin Park , in Victorville and at Laguna Beach 1, it wasn’t the PIGS who allowed the Nazis to publicize and promote your events. It wasn’t the PIGS who refused to renounce Nazism and white supremacy – it was YOU – and you still refuse to renounce them – you only want a comfortable distance – not because you disagree with them, but only because it “looks bad.”


You don’t need other white nationalists to make you look bad – your organization IS a white nationalist group, one preaching the superiority of white “culture” and seeking by all means to ensure white cultural dominance and to “ethnically cleanse” the US.

You never admitted that to yourself did you – that the purpose of SOS is ethnic cleansing.

Neither are you destined for the Hitlerian “greatness” you imagine is your birthright. What you’re destined for is prison, and at the rate you’re going it will happen sooner than later. You’re not destined for the White House any more than Custer was – although he thought otherwise, too.

Although you think you’re clever and original with your “blitzkrieg” tactics taken from Hitler and Custer, the reality is that your over-inflated sense of yourself and your power - your sense of your own impunity – is going to destroy you.

There is nothing you can do about it short of waking up and repenting of your arrogance and overt racism. And that doesn’t seem too likely, Joe.

Any SOS member with a lick of sense would bolt from you like a wild horse – like OC Angel did after the Nazi flags flew over you at Laguna Beach.

Well, this is wasted breath, I imagine. Check you at Ruby Ridge, “patriot.”

Or is that the Little Big Horn?


Joe Turner Wrote:


Hello Patriots:

I have been seething with anger since the rally, analyzing and thinking about how to proceed with this organization. Let me clear some things up.

There isn't another organization in the history of the anti-illegal immigration movement (as far as I know) that has been as aggressive and in your face on a sustained basis. Thus, this problem has never presented itself.

Others suggest that since other organizations do not have this problem, that we are somehow doing something wrong or insufficient. First, no other organization protests under the dynamics that we protest. We are out in the public for any and all to see and participate in. Law enforcement agencies have told us repeatedly that they will not/cannot do anything to keep us separate from anyone else.

The solution to this problem is one that requires a hardline approach and one that may not be amenable to some here. But, I see no other way to handle this situation, other than to quit. Quitting is not an option. We are fighters and we will fight through this obstacle and on to victory.

There are two things that can really harm our organization, the initiating of violence and working in concert with White Supremacists. With recent actions by some law enforcement agencies, I am begining to think that there is a deliberate attempt to sabotage our organization.

In all but one rally (before the goons even started showing up), we as an organization have always initiated contact with the local police department to work with them in an attempt to have a successful/peaceful event. We have made numerous concessions in attempts to alleviate their concerns, allay fears, etc. This has been done by being flexible on rally locations, parking requests, etc.

We have always worked in good faith with the police departments.

In Alhambra, we saw the police department behave in an openly antagonistic fashion. After repeated contacts between myself and LastGreatHope and the police department in which we strongly asked for our group to be separated from the opposition and where we had agreed to occupy one corner to ourselves, Alhambra PD failed to follow through.

They allowed the socialists/anarchists to scream, blow whistles and blare bullhorns in our ears. Literally, an inch from our ears. They allowed them to yell in our faces...within inches, so that spittle flew into our face. They allowed the opposition to jostle us on the sidewalk, take little potshots, elbows, etc.

I specifically demanded separation on site with the officer in charge and others and they blew us off and stated that they could not legally separate us. I stated that they obviously could separate us to keep the peace and prevent violence (mind you, this event occured after BP I where a rally participant was sent to ICU) and that municipalites had done so for years whenever groups like the KKK rallied. Every local police department cordons them off from the public. There is absolutely no reason why the violent goons that have attacked us cannot be cordoned off as well.

I stated that bullhorns in my ear and the possibility of hearing loss/ear trauma constituted assault and that if they did not take immediate action I would physically protect myself from such activity. It is absolutely unconscionable that any police department would allow members of our organization to be surrounded where we could easily be shanked and no one would see it.

It was at this point that I grabbed some copper piping and turned around so that my back was to the street and I was facing our opponents. I was fully prepared to defend myself if need be and to illustrate the seriousness of the matter and the need for immediate action.

Lo and behold, a few minutes later, Alhambra PD began to separate our organization from the socialists/anarchists. Apparently, the Supreme Court returned a decision in the 15 minutes between their telling me that they could not separate us and their eventual separation of our groups.

It is my belief that Alhambra PD wanted us to get intimidated by the opposition and to subsequently leave. It worked to some degree as some members could not locate our scattered group and proceeded to return home instead of facing the rabid opposition by themselves.

It is my belief that Alhambra PD may have wanted members of Save Our State to lash out and initiate conflict with an attempt to sabotage our movement and our organization.

Fast forward to this weekend's Laguna Beach rally. The officers were incredibly hostile and antagonistic. When they chose to enforce the law, it was lopsided against our organization and our law abiding members. I firmly believe, that the members of these police departments believe that they can take great liberty in demanding that our members make concessions to keep the peace and that they are willing to basically allow anything to happen short of an actual outbreak of violence. This means that they will allow the goons to violate laws, try to physically threaten and intimidate our members, etc.

At one point when a goon was thrusting his bullhorn in my face, the officer walked over to me and told me to walk away. I told him that they would follow us anywhere we walked. And this was proven a shorttime later when I took my members to a spot some 20 yards away and the goons were allowed to follow, get in our faces, jostle us, spit on us, etc.

Two members of Save Our State, including myself were spat upon. In my particular instance, an officer was standing right there and he refused to do anything even after I demanded that an arrest be made. In fact, I was the one treated like a criminal as I was marched down the road by two other officers with my hands slammed behind my back. To my knowledge, LBPD did not even take the name of the person who spat in my face.

We made numerous requests for separation. We were told to pound sand. It is my belief that LBPD may have sought to foster such an environment so that we can be tied to these White Supremacists and thus lead to our organiztion being discredited or marginalized.

Save Our State has worked in good faith and given law enforcement agencies the benefit of the doubt. We have asked that our rights be protected, that our persons be protected and that our property be protected. We have been attacked repeatedly and we have bit our tongues and refused to be baited into a response.

In order to solve these problems (hostile opposition, white supremacists and antagonistic police departments) I will be instituting the following steps before we have another event.

1. I will refuse to contact or respond to or work with any police department that has been openly antagonistic to our organization. Police Departments will no longer be given the benefit of the doubt and Save Our State will be less likely to make concessions.

2. We will implement a pre-rally gathering system so that we can enter our rally in unison with the bulk of our members, instead of straggling in.

3. The members of our organization will be self cordoning off our members from White Supremacists and the anarchists/socialists/mechistas, etc. I mean, we will literally have able bodied men standing post at each side and we will tape our boundary off.

4. Any attempt by a member of the opposition to enter or get within spitting distance of our self-designated area, will be physically repelled with the requisite force. The police departments in question have abrogated their duties to protect citizens and to ensure their first amendment rights. In light of their voluntary abrogation, the members of Save Our State will hereby exercise our rights as free Americans and defend ourselves.

5. Any attempt to encroach upon our position by the opposition will be viewed as an attempt to incite a riot/violence and an attempt to assault and inflict bodily harm.

6. Irresponsible and antagonistic actions by police departments will be met with civil litigation.

It is incredibly unfortunate that we have to take these measures to protect our viability. Nevertheless, these steps must be done.

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Listed below are the 10 latest comments of 14 posted about this article.
These comments are anonymously submitted by the website visitors.
Curious behavior Fredric L. Rice Tuesday, Aug. 02, 2005 at 4:01 AM
Wanting and Getting johnk Tuesday, Aug. 02, 2005 at 5:19 AM
internet links and pictures Hex Tuesday, Aug. 02, 2005 at 10:03 AM
Pathological Juan Santos Atahualpa Tuesday, Aug. 02, 2005 at 8:03 PM
Save our State or Save our Springs Aquifer theft from Florida to Chiapas Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 9:34 AM
Dude... littlebopeep Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 11:11 AM
SOS Evasions Chicomozteca Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 12:28 PM
Smart , but disturbed littlebopeep Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 1:47 PM
More, (Yawn) Evasions from SOS Chicomozteca Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 7:01 PM
omG, like da r@c3 w@R mike almeida Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 7:59 PM
"freedom of speech!...except when i disagree with you!" mike almeida Wednesday, Aug. 03, 2005 at 8:06 PM
senor AyatollahGondola Thursday, Aug. 04, 2005 at 1:00 AM
at this point Johnny Thursday, Aug. 04, 2005 at 1:53 AM
A few thoughts. allamericangirl Monday, May. 01, 2006 at 10:42 PM
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