The viciousness of the Israeli assault on Lebanon is underscored by the IDF's use of cluster bombs against civilian targets. As Jan Egeland, who heads up humanitarian operations for the United Nations, put it:

"What's shocking – and I would say to me completely immoral – is that 90% of the cluster bomb strikes occurred in the last 72 hours of the conflict, when we knew there would be a resolution. Every day people are maimed, wounded, and are killed by these ordnance."

As close to a million refugees return to their homes, 100,000 unexploded cluster bombs – most of them dropped by the Israelis in the closing hours of the war – lie in wait for them and their children. Kids often pick up such ordnance because of its resemblance to toys. Such is the sickening legacy of the Israeli aggression, which will continue to deal death long after "peace" is declared.

The Israelis, for their part, defend their use of cluster bombs. Israeli government spokeswoman Miri Eisin philosophized that, while war is "regrettable," dropping the widely condemned ordnance on civilian targets in Lebanon was perfectly legal:

"Israel does not break any international laws in the type of armaments it uses. Their use conforms with international standards."

Eisin, you'll note, didn't even attempt a moral defense of the IDF's murderously cruel tactics: the Israelis long ago ceded the moral high ground and retreated behind a veritable Wall of Separation, beyond good and evil. The spirit of what might be called their Nietzschean foreign policy was well expressed in Israeli UN Ambassador Dan Gillerman's reply to those who decried Israel's response to the kidnapping of two soldiers as wildly disproportionate: "You're damned right this is disproportionate!"

The ordinary rules of morality don't apply to the IDF: Gillerman and his government are explicitly rejecting international moral norms, asserting that Israel has the right to commit any atrocity in the name of "self-defense." And if their "defense" requires the reduction of Lebanon to rubble, then so be it. Such is the creed of the new Israeli Overman.

In normal society, individuals who live by this Nietzschean code of anti-ethics are called sociopaths. Most wind up behind bars. Others find employment in the various branches of government. Gillerman is a proud spokesman for this disturbing trend in official Israeli circles – it was he who wowed the crowd at the March 6 AIPAC conference when he averred,

"While it may be true – and probably is – that not all Muslims are terrorists, it also happens to be true that nearly all terrorists are Muslim."

Insert "Jew" in place of "Muslim," and substitute "international bankers" or "Ecstasy dealers" for "terrorists," and imagine the resulting furor: the speaker would be likened to Hitler and run out of town on a rail. Instead, Gillerman's star rose in the American political firmament, so that by summer he was gracing the stage alongside Hillary Clinton at a pro-Israel rally in New York City:

"Let us finish the job! You know better than anyone else that what we are doing is doing your own work: fighting terror…. And to those countries who claim we are using disproportionate force, I have only this to say: you're damn right we are!"

This braying, swaggering arrogance is the sort of style one usually associates with the historic enemies of the Jewish people – jackbooted fascists and neo-Nazis, who wear their nihilistic ruthlessness on their sleeves alongside their swastika armbands. Here is yet more evidence of my thesis that Israeli society, deformed by perpetual war and disfigured by state controls, is morphing into a form of fascism, including a mass movement with global reach that mimics the historical forms of national socialism – minus, of course, the requisite anti-Semitism. The national-socialist Sparta of the Middle East, egged on by its radicalized American amen corner, is embarked on a campaign of aggression that can only end in disaster for all – the United States included.

The reality, in spite of Gillerman's contention that the Israelis are (somehow) fighting our fight, is that the Americans will be drawn into any war sparked by another proudly disproportionate strike by the IDF. We'll have to finish what they start. This is the one overriding principle of our policy, the mad "America last, Israel first" paradigm that distorts the rational pursuit of U.S. interests in the region. The IDF makes a mess in Lebanon – and we are charged with cleaning it up. When the Israelis aren't bulldozing the homes of their Palestinian helots, they're using them for target practice – and the ire of the Arab-Muslim world is directed at us, because those bulldozers and those bullets were paid for by American taxpayers, just as those cluster bombs that continue to kill and maim Lebanese civilians were made in – and paid for by – the U.S.

Amnesty International is urging the Israelis to provide maps of areas where cluster bombs were dropped, in an effort to clean up the deadly debris left behind by the invaders, but the Israelis, proud of their ruthlessness, are unlikely to assent. After all, can't you just hear Gillerman braying his defiance at those who "claim" that the IDF's dropping such deadly ordnance means Lebanese children are dying: You're damned right they are!

As for that investigation by the U.S. State Department into allegations U.S.-made cluster bombs were found in south Lebanon – and used in violation of several long-standing agreements to which Israel is a party, as well as U.S. laws, including the Arms Export Control Act – I wouldn't bet the ranch on any conclusive results or corrective action. As this New York Times piece suggests, no one expects the State Department probe, undertaken by the directorate of Defense Trade Controls, will lead to sanctions against the Israelis. By going through the motions, however, the Bush administration hopes to bolster its stock with its Arab allies – or, at least, prevent it sinking from sight.

Sinking very far from sight is the likely fate of the State Department investigation – unless antiwar activists keep the issue in the spotlight and force Congress (especially "antiwar" Democratic candidates for Congress) to take a position. Cluster bombs dropped on Lebanese civilians, Ned Lamont – are you for or against?

The U.S. is now demanding that sanctions be imposed on Iran for what Tehran might do in the future, for aggression that has not yet been committed, and yet the Israelis are immunized from any penalty for what they have already done. This kind of hypocrisy is astonishing – and yet more evidence that, even as the Israelis place themselves beyond good and evil, the U.S. is fully complicit in their crimes. And it's all paid for by you, the American taxpayers.

Wow! Remember when zionists were quoting Jan England? (rabidly, in fact) --sure is quiet here now.

Live, on HDTV with DTS surround sound.

Yeah, that was hilarious--LMFAO! For awhile the frothing at the mouth pro-jizrael trolls were quoting Jan right and laeft--they were giddy with joy to quote a UN official to support their flimsy arguments....

Funny how UN and UN officials are only good when its convenient....

we have here a confluence of cowards and creeps try to avoid the spite and nasty Israeli psychology rooted so deeply in not racism but plain imperial arrogance.

Whining about the payloads of ball bearings while sowing huge anti -civilian mine fields.

Unbelievable hypocrisy.

The persuasive lead article is well written.

It really supports the notion that these nut jobs promoting Israeli policies want the wrath of the world on them. Israel must disarm because they are dangerous. Sanctions are a good idea. Reparations too. Not a damn dime more for Israel.

I really need helpI need medication. I futily troll for Jizrael all day and night. No one pays attention to me (unless they're toying with me) and even my friends have abandoned me to my pointless pathological trolling for the terror state of Jizrael. I am a pthetic fuckwit with no life. I wish a Katushya would just land on my house and end my misery. Some days, I just rock back and forth and hold myself, babbling incoherently until mommy delivers my Thorazine.

Nah, Israel started the mess, they should pay for it. Literally. They should start by opening up their nuclear weapons facilities for dismantling. Before any food, medicine, school supplies, or anything is allowed into Israel. Like the sanctions Iraq was forced to endure. I bet the plush would rub off real quick from their high horse.

Too bad about all those ball bearings. Clean up must be tedious.

come on, you know it's not nice to forge my nick. At least I can come up with brand new ones, tisk.

Hey, I got an idea. Send the 'settlers' into Lebanon to clear the hangfire munitions out.

By hand, like the civilians coming back to shattered lives seem to be doing.

Hey "S d", why don't you join your beloved IDF?

Oh, that's right, you're just a coward troll....BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Dismissed, Kalba.

To bad about that division of tanks...

Damn rusky RPGs.

Anyway, if I am so irreverent , why do you even respond to little me?

Halaluya...can I have a witness?

Can't I be beyond good or evil and pontificate about how infallible my dogma is, like you can?

How about Mr. Israel Keyboard Kamander being used to clear all the hangfires. You might have to take off your bathrobe & slippers.

Under the 'you broke it and now you fix it' theory.

and you say *we* have run out of ideas? Ha. is this little bot response; your version of IMC area denial?

what's new. nothing from your side. You're pulling a pantload and it shows.

Ha. *You're* a keystroke away from being *irrelevant .

*You idiot, I was employing satire,,, sheeesh.

A genocide is taking place in Gaza. This morning, 2 September, another three citizens of Gaza were killed and a whole family wounded in Beit Hanoun. This is the morning reap, before the end of day many more will be massacred. An average of eight Palestinian die daily in the Israeli attacks on the Strip. Most of them are children. Hundreds are maimed, wounded and paralyzed.

The Israeli leadership is at lost of what to do with the Gaza Strip. It has vague ideas about the West Bank. The current government assumes that the West Bank, unlike the Strip, in an open space, at least on its eastern side. Hence if Israel, under the ingathering program of the government, annexes the parts it covets – half of the West Bank – and cleanse it from its native population, the other half would naturally lean towards Jordan, at least for a while and would not concern Israel. This is a fallacy, but nonetheless it won the enthusiastic vote of most of the Jews in the country. Such an arrangement can not work in the Gaza enclave – Egypt unlike Jordan has succeeded in persuading the Israelis, already in 1948, that the Gaza Strip for them is a liability and will never form part of Egypt. So a million and half Palestinians are stuck inside Israel – although geographically the Strip is located on the margins of the state, psychologically it lies in its midst.

The inhuman living conditions in the most dense area in the world, and one of the poorest human spaces in the northern hemisphere, disables the people who live it to reconcile with the imprisonment Israel had imposed on them ever since 1967. They were relative better period where movement to the West Bank and into Israel for work was allowed, but these better times are gone. Harsher realities are in place ever since 1987. Some access to the outside world was allowed as long as there were Jewish settlers in the Strip, but once they were removed the Strip was hermetically closed. Ironically, most Israelis, according to recent polls, look at Gaza as an independent Palestinian state that Israel has graciously allowed to emerge. The leadership, and particularly the army, see it as a prison with the most dangerous community of inmates, which has to be eliminated one way or another.

The conventional Israeli policies of ethnic cleansing employed successfully in 1948 against half of Palestine’s population, and against hundred of thousand of Palestinians in the West Bank are not useful here. You can slowly transfer Palestinians out of the West Bank, and particular out of the Greater Jerusalem area, but you can not do it in the Gaza Strip - once you sealed it as a maximum-security prison camp.

As with the ethnic cleansing operations, the genocidal policy is not formulated in a vacuum. Ever since 1948, the Israeli army and government needed a pretext to commence such policies. The takeover of Palestine in 1948 produced the inevitable local resistance that in turn allowed the implementation of an ethnic cleansing policy, preplanned already in the 1930. Twenty years of Israeli occupation of the West Bank produced eventually some sort of Palestinian resistance. This belated anti-occupation struggle unleashed a new cleansing policy that still is implemented today in the West Bank. The Gaza imprisonment in the summer of 2005, which was paraded as an Israeli generous withdrawal, produced the Hamas and Islamic Jiahd missile attack and one abduction case. Even before the abduction of Giald Shalit, the Israeli army bombarded indiscriminately the Strip. Ever since the abduction, the massive killing increased and became systematic. A daily business of slaying Palestinians, mainly children is now reported in the internal pages of the local press, quite often in microscopic fonts.

The chief culprits are the Israeli pilots who have a field day now that one of them is the General Chief of Staff. In the 1982 Lebanon war, the Israeli airforce issued orders to its pilots to abort mission if within 500 square meters of their target they spotted innocent civilians. Not that these orders were kept, but the pretense for internal moral consumption was there. It is called in the Israeli airforce, the ‘Lebanon Procedure’ [Nohal Levanon]. When the pilots asked a year ago if the ‘Lebanon procedure’ is in tact for Gaza, the answer was no. The same answer was given to the pilots in the second Lebanon war.

The Lebanon war provided the fog for a while, covering the war crimes in the Gaza Strip. But the policies rage on even after the conclusion of the cease-fire up in the north. It seems that the frustrated and defeated Israeli army is even more determined to enlarge the killing fields in the Gaza Strip. There are no politicians who are able or willing to stop the generals. A daily killing of up to 10 civilians is going to leave few thousands dead each year. This is of course different from genociding a million people in one campaign – the only inhibition Israel is willing to undertake in the name of the Holocaust memory. But if you double the killing you raise the number to horrific proportions and more importantly you may force a mass eviction in the end of the day outside the Strip – either in the name of human aid, international intervention or the people’s own desire to escape the inferno. But if the Palestinian steadfastness is going to be the response, and there no reason to doubt that this will the Gazan reaction then the massive killing would continue and increase.

Much depends on the international reaction. When Israel was absolved from any responsibility or accountably for the ethnic cleansing in 1948, it turned this policy into a legitimate tool for its national security agenda. If the present escalation and adaptation of genocidal policies would be tolerated by the world, it would expand and used even more drastically.

Nothing apart from pressure in the from of sanctions, boycott and divestment will stop the murdering of innocent civilians in the Gaza Strip. There is nothing we here in Israel can do against it. Brave pilots refused to partake in the operations, two journalists – out of 150 – do not cease to write about it, but this is it. In the name of the holocaust memory let us hope the world would not allow the genocide of Gaza to continue.



Ilan Pappe is senior lecturer in the University of Haifa Department of political Science and Chair of the Emil Touma Institute for Palestinian Studies in Haifa. His books include among others The Making of the Arab-Israeli Conflict (London and New York 1992), The Israel/Palestine Question (London and New York 1999), A History of Modern Palestine (Cambridge 2003), The Modern Middle East (London and New York 2005) and forthcoming, Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine (2006)

-"When Israel was absolved from any responsibility or accountably for the ethnic cleansing in 1948, it turned this policy into a legitimate tool for its national security agenda."-

And the reason nobody ( except the people who were directly involved ) noticed was because everyone here was busy spending the paper made during the WWII production surge. Little of that production came back to the people who paid for it however but corporations who rebuilt their technology up because of it, did, as they reaped the benefits.

Pigs too busy feeding as they formulated the marshal plan, to sell washing machines to France and Germany and Italy, to notice. The press was muzzled by the H word.

Americans were self-centered greedy assholes then, just like they were long before WWII, just like they still are.

Which comes in handy for those who own the propaganda machine. When they want us up in arms about something that's none of our business (e.g. the "Godlessness" of Filipinos, circa 1900 CE), they just give it a spin that's bound to appeal to any self-centered greeedy asshole's opportunistic sense of "morality"

"Hey, we can cop a "moral" excuse for blowing all these spear-waving picaninnies up with 16-inch artillery shells and stealing all their shit and becoming EVEN MORE PIG-RICH THAN WE ALREADY ARE!!!! Say no more!!!!"

It's like hitting a button. Been that way since 1776

BECKY: I'm one of the most prolific writers on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict yet I have never quoted Jan Egeland.

FROM THE LEAD ARTICLE: "The reality, in spite of Gillerman's contention that the Israelis are (somehow) fighting our fight, is that the Americans will be drawn into any war sparked by another proudly disproportionate strike by the IDF."

BECKY: Hezbollah has killed more Americans than any other terrorist organization with the exception of Al Qaeda. Hezbollah has vowed to kill Jews whereever they exist on the planet and to kill Americans as well. Hezbollah is on the US State Dept. list of terrorist organizations.



The inconvenient fact, that neither the lead article nor any of the remaining comments still posted seems to mention is that it was Hezbollah that started this conflict.

It was their unprovoked attack across the legal, Israeli border into sovereign Israeli territory, to attack and kill 3 IDF soldiers, kidnap 2 more, and when a tank in hot pursuit crossed into Lebanese territory hit a landmine, 4 more IDF soldiers died. A 5th soldier died when he was shot trying to rescue the other 4. During this attack, Hezbollah launched a hail of rockets at both IDF positions inside of Israel and at civlilan targets in Kiryat Shmona.

Hezbollah initiated this conflict and continued to rain bombs on N. Israel for weeks. Israel had only two choices at that time:

1. give up on the kidnapped soldiers; ignore the bombs falling on their cities

2. fight back at Hezbollah positions firing hte rockets--try to get the soldiers back

Why there is so much outrage that Israel chose to fight back shows the disingenous nature of those who claim to advocate for fairness or justice.

BTW--Egeland is misquoted here. He did NOT say that there are 100,000 unexploded ISRAELI CLUSTER BOMBS .

He said "They (the UN team) are shocked by seeing how many unexploded bombs, grenades, mines, and especially cluster bomb bomblets there are." Egeland then estimates around 100,000 SUCH OBJECTS are littered on the surface, most from Israeli forces in the final days of the war."

BECKY: So the ESTIMATE is for unexploded bombs, grenades, mines, and cluster bomb bomblets left by BOTH SIDES--unless Egeland is claiming that only Israeli unexploded ordnance is left or that unexploded Hezbollah ordnance is somehow harmless.

so much BS, so little time to shovel it.

Oh, here's a big one:

"The inconvenient fact, that neither the lead article nor any of the remaining comments still posted seems to mention ( most likely because it is a fantasy from a mind capable of retaining only so many items and thusly loses a few now and then) is that ( here's the 1st one here, anyway ) it was Hezbollah that started this conflict. ( now we are treated with two separate items that have merged in little Ms. BJ's mind, or is that Ms. BJ's little mind.. )

It was their unprovoked attack across the legal, Israeli border into sovereign Israeli ( wrong , Ms. BJ it was an israeli incursion into Lebanon )territory, to attack ( meaning to interdict ) and kill 3 IDF soldiers, kidnap ( something about stupidity almost makes you want to laugh when an individual can't tell the difference between 'captured [as in busted doing espionage in another sovereign country which was Lebanon ] and 'kidnapped', but that's part of the la la land of Ms. BJ's World™ oh well...) 2 more, and when ( in a totally different mission, at the end of the conflict ) a tank in hot pursuit ( read - retreat ) crossed ( foot through the floor board which explains the following ) into ( out from )Lebanese territory [ and or ',' ] hit a landmine, 4 more IDF soldiers died. A 5th soldier died when he was shot trying to rescue the other 4. During this attack [ meaning the arabs have RPGs!!? ], Hezbollah launched a hail of rockets at both IDF positions inside of Israel [ 'cause the IDF was still shelling Lebanon ] and at civlilan targets [ area fire 'cause H don't have jets, attack choppers, much artillary or tanks and multiple launchers for cluster munitions which you said weren't being used and, of course were being used ] in Kiryat Shmona. "

they hit one of the mines that they had left in Lebanon. Messy, that's for sure. They never clean up after themselves.

Let me see if I got this right:

YOU said:

Project (ad hominem attack)

by (anonymous pseudonym) Monday, Sep. 04, 2006 at 7:30 PM

so much (insult), so little time to (unfortunate metaphor)

Oh, here's a big one:

"The inconvenient fact, that neither the lead article nor any of the remaining comments still posted seems to mention ( put down) is that ( here's the 1st one here, anyway ) it was Hezbollah that started this conflict. ( now we are treated with two separate items that have merged in (diminutive) Ms. (sexual innuendo) s (ad hominem attack), or is that Ms. (sexual innuendo)'s (diminutive) (body part.. )

Have I got your message correct so far?

Of course not; but we should all know just how back -assward is your 'information' in your own private Ms. BJ's World™

Your ' information' is not information at all but some confabulation only you believe.

The reader should scroll up and see for themself.

Who cares what the zionist echo chorus says? We know about the views and talents you zionazis have to avoid the facts.

It must be really important to get Ms. BJ planted here. Too bad her lies require constant pruning.

this is fun.

As I have stated before, Ms. BJ offers ME a grand opportunity to actually reveal the absurdities in this sorry excuse for a 'journalist'.

And yes, after reading the posts from this individual, I have made it personal.

Want to know why?

It's like driving. Now stay w/me here for a moment and I'll explain.

I really don't appreciate people who endanger my life w/their numb stupidity and or malicious distain for traffic laws. Or truth.

So ...

"Landmines ( and the ones that were left over)

by Becky Johnson Monday, Sep. 04, 2006 at 11:50 PM

Santa Cruz, CA.

I wondered [ about ] that myself. Did the IDF hit a leftover landmine from the Israeli occupation pre-2000?[ it happened and why didn't israel clean up the deadly hazard ] Or [ here we again voyage into Ms. BJ's World™ where anything is possible if not probable considering israeli records show these fields and as any infantry soldier knows, you always map your fields 'cause it's REAL important ] did they hit a Hezbollah landmine. It could [ in the afore mentioned land of Peter Pan ] have been either one. Most likely Hezbollah [ because in Ms. BJ's World™ israel can never do any wrong ] because (hopefully) the IDF would have maps of their own landmines (though not necessarily). And also because with all that time passage, Hezbollah could and did [ Ms. BJ mossad conections told her so we know this to be a verified fact backed up w/testamoney from at least two independent sources ] plant its own landmines.

Still, it COULD have been an IDF landmine come back to haunt them. However, the rifle fire that killed the 5th soldier was all Hezbollah.

As I said before, I think cluster bombs should be banned. " [ unless israel is using them as witnessed by this individual's absolute silence and denial during the time they were being used, as per Ms. BJ's World™ view.]

Is the RPG-29 to Blame for Israeli Failures in Lebanon?

Viktor Litovkin, RIA Novosti (MOSCOW) - Tuesday, 29 August 2006, 01:56

Israeli Public Security Minister Avi Dichter and Defense Minister Amir Peretz said Hizbollah was using modern anti-tank weapons of Russian make, specifically the RPG-29 Vampirs with a tandem warhead. Such statements have perplexed Russian arms experts, but they agreed to talk with me if I did not mention their names.

"As usually happens in war, either side can interpret our words in its favor, and we don't want that. We are neutral, and do not want to be accused of bias," one of them said.

The main point they made is this: the fact that Hizbollah militants are armed with RPG-29 handheld anti-tank grenade launchers does not mean that they received them from Syria, which acquired them in the course of military-technical cooperation with Moscow. A suspicion is not a fact. Facts must be proved by documented evidence, but there is none.

The fragments of projectiles and the tailpiece, which the Israelis have sent to us, do not provide any evidence of anything. They do indeed bear the letters of the Russian (Cyrillic) alphabet, but this is not enough for a complete examination. We have to look at the serial numbers of the weapons in order to determine where they were made, who sold them, and to whom.

The experts explained that the RPG-29 Vampir with a tandem HEAT (high explosive anti-tank) PG-29V warhead was developed in the late 1980s when tanks acquired reactive armor. The Soviet army received them in 1989. After the disintegration of the Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact, these grenade launchers and their projectiles could be found in almost all the newly independent ex-communist nations. They were even produced in some of them. Trying to establish whose grenades are hitting Israeli tanks will be pure guesswork.

If a contract on arms supplies is official, or "white", it always mentions the end user. But apart from white contracts there are semi-official, or "grey", exports, and even "black", which are unofficial and illegal.

Anyone from any country could sell RPG-29s to the Middle East, the Palestinians, Hizbollah, Hamas, or any other armed group. Elaborate set-ups could be used to do so. The experts did not name countries or companies, acting according to the innocent-until-proven-guilty principle, but many have already been proven guilty. Trials of illegal arms merchants have long ceased being a sensation. If senior officials have suspicions, or even make public accusations, they should back their statements with documents. Without facts this is idle talk and even political scheming.

The military experts observed that talk of "wrongful use of Russian weapons" starts whenever one of the sides has setbacks at the front lines. This is what the Americans did in Vietnam, and this is what they are doing in Iraq more than twenty years later, when they blame Russia for the fact that the militants are fighting with Russian arms. What other arms could they have if Iraqi leaders were getting them officially from the Soviet Union for almost 30 years? Now Israeli officials have followed suit.

The experts said that in accusing Russia of indirect support for the other side, politicians fail to realize that they admit their helplessness and discredit their own weapons and combat hardware. The Merkava tank has always been considered invincible in Israel. The Israelis were proud of its design and its upgraded reactive armor. They claimed it was the best tank in the world. Tactically, the Israeli army has used it very skillfully in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank. Merkavas entered rural districts only when they were supported by helicopters, and had direct and stable communication with them.

But, apparently, there are not enough helicopters for tank support on Lebanese territory. The crew of any tank can see very little. They do not know what is happening on the sides or in the back. It is an easy target for any militant, who can hide in the bushes or behind a jamb. He does not need to attack a Merkava from the front, where it does indeed have excellent protection. He can hit it from the side, the rear, or the space between the running gear - any tank has many vulnerable spots. Perfect weapons simply do not exist. So why complain about a Russian grenade launcher?

The experts thanked the Israeli ministers for the free promotion of Russian weapons, but repeated they had nothing to do with this.

They observed that Israeli tanks were hit in Lebanon, not in Israel. Members of Hizbollah, no matter what emotions they may evoke, are mostly citizens of Lebanon, and have a lawful right to defend their land against the aggressor. At this point the experts said that they were reluctant to go into politics. They switched back to weapons, and added that Israel was not only using its own weapons.

The Merkava is an Israeli tank, but the M-113A1/A2 and M-577A2, on which Israeli soldiers drive into Lebanon, are of American make. The same applies to the following helicopters: the AH-1E/Bell-209, Chechnya-53D Stallion, UH-60 Blackhawk, S-70A, and assault AH-64 Apache. All their artillery - the AMRAAM, AIM-120B, AIM-95, and even the MLRS 227 multiple-launch rocket systems - were also made in the United States, not to mention assault aircraft, bombers, and fighters. The experts asked rhetorically: "Why blame anyone, if you are bombing a foreign country with foreign weapons?"

I did not argue with them. As a journalist, I merely try to familiarize readers with an opinion, which is different from what some Israeli leaders do regarding the "participation" of Russia and its weapons in the bloody conflict in the Middle East.

http://www.imemc.org/content/view/21136/1/

" How am i endangering your life?"

answer.

Through your mindless defense of israel, you are lying and excusing this dangerous nuclear state who will likely begin a nuclear war.

you're killing me right now...

can't stop laughing please wait

ahhh.

The state of israel HAS attacked and killed their neighbors.

And they sure have a lot of 'knives'.

from : Damn Rusky RPG's

""As usually happens in war, either side can interpret our words in its favor, and we don't want that. We are neutral, and do not want to be accused of bias," one of them said."

BECKY: This is good news. The Russians have adopted a neutral position on the Israeli-Hezbollah conflict. If only Syria and Iran would follow suit.

Iran and Syria are not the problem.

The H is not the problem.

Israel who has nuclear weapons and has its meat puppets who try to cover the sh*t over, is the problem.

from CNN:

Who Has Nukes?

Nations currently known to have ready nuclear arsenals and the approximate size of those arsenals are:

United States: 12,000 warheads

Russia: 22,500 warheads

United Kingdom: 380 warheads

France: 450 warheads

China: 400 warheads

Pakistan: 12-18 warheads

India: 12-18 warheads

QUESTION FOR SHEEPDOG: So where is your outrage against Russian nukes? UK nukes? French nukes? Chinese nukes? Pakistani nukes? Indian nukes? how about the nukes in our own country paid for with your very own tax dollars? NO!! you have to single out Israeli nukes--which they don't even admit they have--for rebuke.

We DO need to move towards a world where all nuclear weapons are abolished and dismantled. But the way you single out Israel demonstrates your own bigotry and little else.

All those other countries *admit* they have nukes.

we keep hearing the yammer about 'Islamic bombs' but we never hear about 'Zion bombs'.

Didn't think so....

anybody who reads this board regularly will know what I'm talking about. if they're curious that is for them to do the research. The newswire is bountiful with aspects to your 'challenges' which you would have your parrot. forget.

One merely needs to view the articles listed and read through them. They can see for themself. Yup.

I chose to not waste my time with your game.

It's a "mistake" when the IDF does it....because Israel is perfect , and sweet and gentle......except when they do this:

Seeing anti-zionist in the cornflakes again. Yes, we're part of a tag-team 'conspiracy'. LMFAO!

What is the funniest, is that Schtarker Yid, spammer extraordinare, calls others spammer

Just weed through his HUNDREDS of hidden irrelevant comments:

http://la.indymedia.org/news/?keyword=&author=&comments=yes&display=f&year=&month=&day=&medium=&language_id=&category=0&sort=&limit=30

That doesn't disprove anything. My guess is that you and Tia are an item or just in the same office with SY supplying the spam and other noise.

What is this allegation based on?

Who's Toady?

I meant TW and Tia. They fight like married people.

Could be Tia W and TW. Or could they be the same person?

I don't think so. not the same. Tia would be sweet and nice until she put a shiv into you or had someone else do the work .

Psychoboy is most likely just doing it for mass-debation to prove its 'manhood'.

TW is debating Sheepdog. Not Tia.

no no no.

"TW is debating Sheepdog"

that's not a 'debate' that's TW. having a spaz fest in the face of his 'planes did it' conspiracy theory dissolving into profanity and 'could have beens' with absurd barrazo world explanations of mere visual evidence, most of which he provided.

I mean that it sure looks like TW or Psychoboy and Tia are coworkers if not more.

All I know is they sure carry intimate 'arguments'. Look up their 'arguments'.

Check it out.

you ever see what a claymore will do?

Whew!

war is hell.

who has credibility?

'tisk.

BTW. What is that photo of my test plate doing on your drive?

Lovely grouping.

chatty kathy sez

by Hi Tea @ Level Seven Sunday, Sep. 24, 2006 at 9:55 AM


All I know is they sure carry intimate 'arguments'. Look up their 'arguments'.>



Its probably the opposite. They despise each other so much, that they have deliberately stepped beyond the bounds of societal niceities. Its a parody of intimacy, not actual intimacy. I think. Or do you think TW is Mossad, and is infiltrating Indymedia top make leftists look bad? If yes, damn, they are good.

Come on, that's very clumsy insertion over a coincidental conflict.

I know the tricks.

That's how you by pass security on a secure area for instance, by drawing attention to a fight. This character starts out by being 'helpful' and rests like a spider, waiting for uncomfortable subjects ( DU global contamination, for instance ) to pop up in order to jump on any pertinent input. Normally with abusive and hostile distractions.

And just watching them they seem to know who is conversing without any 'confusion' ( like the few proceeding comments ) as to who is authoring the post. Yep. Married. Don't know if it's holy in the eyes of god, though.

chatty kathy sez

If you don't know the new game, then why don't you watch and learn?

All your old systems are belong to us.

Don't be pushed into the chasm of the awakened beast at your back.

Resistance is futile. Surrender and mercy will be granted if you don't really piss us off.

oh no that's pure deduction. Not slander. Damnit look up the term. Where's the 'damage' Ms. Sugarpie, 'cause I don't see any.

Did you take enough notes on your boy as he is self fed into the shredder of my scorn?

You may not be K_I_S_S_I_N_G but we should draw the blinds as to what you *are* doing, to protect the children.

So Toady is Matt Fitt?

Is someone feeling a bit of a cold draft where it's usually warm?

Pull up your pants.

Number of Arabs killed in the framework of Israeli-Arab conflicts since the creation of Israel (including in the 1948 war for Israel’s independence, all the wars fought between Israel and its neighbors, and the occupation of Palestinians): 60,000.

Number of Algerian Muslims killed by the French in the 1950’s Algerian war for Independence: Between 500,000 to 1 million.

Number of Muslims killed by other Muslims in the 1990’s Algerian civil war: 100,000.

Number of people, including some Muslims, killed by Muslims in Sudan between 1955 and today: 2.6 million- 3 million.

Number of Muslims killed by the Soviets in Afghanistan in the 1980’s: at least 1 million

Number of Muslims killed by other Muslims in the Afghan civil war of the 1980’s-90’s: 1 million

Number of Muslims killed by the Americans in efforts to overthrow the Taliban: less than 10,000.

Number of Muslims killed by other Muslims since 1977 in Somalia’s civil war: Between 400,000- 550,000.

Number of Muslims in Bangladesh killed by other Muslims from Pakistan since 1977: 1.4 million-2 million

Number of Muslims killed by other Muslims in Indonesia since 1965: at least 400,000.

Number of Muslims in East Timor killed between 1975-1999 by Muslims from Indonesia: 100,000 - 200,000

Number of Muslims killed in Iraq by other Muslims (mostly those in the regime of Saddam Hussein): 1.54 million- 2 million

Number of Iranian Muslims killed in their war with Iraq: 450,000 - 970,000

Number of Lebanese killed by Israelis between 1975-1990: up to 18,000 (this number is included in the first statistic given several lines up, about Arab deaths at Israel’s hands)

Number of Lebanese killed by other Lebanese or by Syrians between 1975-1990: at least 112,000.

Number of Yemenites, Egyptians, and Saudis killed in the Yemen civil war of 1962, and in the Yemen riots of 1984-1986: 100,000 - 150,000

Number of Chechen Muslims killed by the Russians since 1992: 80,000- 300,000

Number of Arabs and Muslims killed in Jordan (includes at least a few thousand Palestinians), Chad, Yugoslavia, Tajikistan, Syria, Iran, Turkey, and Zanzibar in the course of smaller conflicts in the 1970’s, 80’s, and 90’s: at least 150,000.