The results of a recent poll conducted in Israel are very disturbing to anyone who abhors racism and discrimination. The survey found that anti-Arab sentiment was widespread among Israeli Jewish citizens. The poll was conducted by Geocartographia for the Centre for the Struggle Against Racism.

The findings of the poll include the following:
1. More than two-thirds of Israeli Jews would refuse to live in the same building as an Arab.
2. Nearly half would not allow an Arab in their home.
3. 41% want entertainment facilities to be segregated.
4. 40% think Israel should "support the emigration of Arab citizens."
5. 63% consider Israeli Arab citizens a "security and demographic threat to the state."
6. 34% agreed with the statement that "Arab culture is inferior to Israeli culture."
7. 18% stated that they felt hatred when they heard someone speaking Arabic.

These findings would be outrageous enough on their own, but unfortunately the recent elections in Israel indicate that votes were gained by those parties which had anti-Arab platforms which appealed to the racist sentiments above.

For instance, the Yisrael Beiteinu party, which made major advances in the election, advocates redrawing the border of Israel to place a half-million Arab-Israelis outside of Israel. Party chairman Avigdor Lieberman stated, "We have become the largest party in the national camp and I’m certain that next time we will be Israel’s ruling party. This is only the beginning." The beginning of what is the question.

Other far-right parties also gained votes with their anti-Arab platforms in the elections. Rather than redrawing the borders though, many of the far-right advocate “transfer” of Arabs from both Israel and the “occupied territories.” Transfer is merely code for ethnic cleansing. Under international law such action is clearly unlawful. But then Israel, with U.S. backing, has consistently violated international law. Whenever the U.N. attempts to do something about this, the U.S. exercises its veto power to squelch action and protect its ally and partner in crime.

Even the so-called "centrist" Kadima party, which won the largest number of votes, made a decision not to include an Arab in a viable position on its election list because it feared that it would cost the party several seats, according to a report by the Haaretz newspaper.

Israeli newspapers regularly discuss the racist term “demographic time bomb.” This refers to the high birthrate among Arab citizens of Israel as compared to the birthrate among Jewish citizens. Those that use the term raise the “fear” that Arab citizens will one day outnumber the Jewish citizens unless something is done. They then advocate emigration (ethnic cleansing in another form) of Arab Israeli citizens or other policies such as limiting re-unification of Arab citizens with family members. Thousands of Arab citizens are currently forcefully separated from their family members by restrictive and racist immigration policies.

Supporters of Israel often claim that it is “the only democracy in the Middle East.” But discriminatory practices reminiscent of the Jim Crow laws keep a large part of the population of Israel subjugated. Of course in the “occupied territories” the Israeli government does not even pretend to be democratic in its rule. There the Israeli government openly rules with military force. Using U.S.-supplied weapons and military hardware it regularly terrorizes the Palestinian population.

The survey and recent election do not hold out the hope for change in Israeli policy, nor do past surveys. A 2002 survey reported that 80 percent of those Israelis polled opposed the participation of Arab Israelis in any “critical decisions affecting the state.” So much for democracy.

But Israeli policy toward Palestinian Arabs has been consistent since the founding of Israel in 1948. After all, Israel is a settler state founded on the principles of Zionism which only recognize the existence of a "Jewish state". Zionists believe that they have the right to occupy “historic Israel”, meaning the lands that were allegedly once part of a Jewish kingdom 20 centuries ago. Of course among the Zionists they have been unable to agree on the geographic boundaries encompassed by “historic Israel.” For some, the West Bank and parts of Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, and even Iraq fall within the boundaries.

But in twentieth century this land was occupied by Palestinian Arabs and also a Jewish minority. In the 1948 war, the Zionists used terrorism and massacre to expel much of the existing Palestinian population. Before the war there were approximately 850,000 Arabs within what became Israel. After the war about 130,000 remained. These Palestinian Arabs eventually became Israeli citizens, albeit second class ones. Today, they and their descendants number over a million and are about one-fifth of the Israeli population.

The displaced Arabs were replaced by the immigration of Jews from all over the world. Under the Zionist Law of Return, any Jew has the right to immigrate to Israel and is automatically granted citizenship, along with spouses, children and grandchildren. At the same time, some Israeli Arabs have been denied the right of return after taking vacations out of the country or visiting relatives in the occupied territories.

Even the U.S. government has had to admit that the Arab segment of the population is oppressed. In the 2004 Country Reports on Human Rights Practices published by the U.S. State Department it is stated, “The [Israeli] Government did little to reduce institutional, legal, and societal discrimination against the country’s Arab citizens…”

This is in direct contravention of Article 26 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR) adopted by the U.N. General Assembly in December 1966 which states, “All Persons are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to the equal protection of the law. In this respect the law shall prohibit any discrimination on any grounds such as race, colour, sex, language, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status.”

Although Israel ratified the ICCPR it has consistently failed to implement it. Within Israel, Arabs are treated as second class citizens. In the occupied territories they have no rights at all and are imprisoned by the thousands if not actually killed in regular Israeli military operations.

Anti-Semitism led to the deaths of millions in the twentieth century. In Germany and Nazi occupied Europe, Jews were at first treated as second class citizens. Eventually they were treated as non-humans and subjected to extermination which led to the deaths of six million. Those that deplore the holocaust must speak out against all forms of discrimination and racism if we are to prevent other atrocities. It is not acceptable to stay silent about Israel and its discriminatory policies because we fear being branded as anti-Semitic.

Today Israel illegally occupies Palestinian land and is in the process of building an apartheid wall reminiscent of the walls that surrounded Jewish ghettos in Europe. It deprives many of the occupants of this land of basic human and political rights. The U.S. spends billions each year in support of Israel and its policies. The American people must take the responsibility for ending this support. We can not pretend we did not know what is being done. We can not be like the “good Germans” who pled ignorance of what the Hitler regime did in the name of the German people. We must do all that we can to oppose all actions of Israel and the U.S. government which oppress the Palestinian Arabs under Israeli rule.

I'm sure that everyone who follows this board will be attending those public Torah readings, but to get back to the subject at hand, it seems to me that the poll reveals a degree of anti-Arab prejudice that would surpass in intensity any poll of anti-semitism in today's Europe - including states that were fascist or allied with Germany and Italy in World War II. I sort of reminds me of the sad fact that abused children often grow up to be abusers themselves. I'm not saying that the victms of the Holocaust were children (except for the actual children), but the psychological transformation from victim to victimizer is strikingly similar.

"I'm not saying that the victms of the Holocaust were children (except for the actual children), but the psychological transformation from victim to victimizer is strikingly similar."

You don't need to resort to smartmouthed forms of verbiage to frame your contention. You come across quite clearly as an antisemite, even if not of the card carrying variety. An antisemite faulting the Israeli Jews (as if they're all "European" rather than split down roughly evenly between such and non-Ashkenazi) for having become more uppity than they were in their classic victim roles.

aWhat is this?

-From Mr. London:
You don't need to resort to smartmouthed forms of verbiage to frame your contention. You come across quite clearly as an antisemite, even if not of the card carrying variety. An antisemite faulting the Israeli Jews (as if they're all "European" rather than split down roughly evenly between such and non-Ashkenazi) for having become more uppity than they were in their classic victim roles.-

next unhidden post
-?a
by a Friday, Jun. 02, 2006 at 2:20 PM

aWhat is this?-

Answer:
Wheezer the 'goated Jew' is having a hard time w/o spam assist.

Ah, yes, I forgot the rule that one must never criticize the Holy State. What I really meant to say was that the poll indicates a high degree of tolerance and enlightened sophistication, and is one more proof that Israel is an oasis of freedom and democracy. We should be sending it billions more in military aid, not less. I bet that public Torah readings contribute to the wonderful spirit of humanism that is evident in the poll results.

messed up my last post big time my bad.

Mr. London had this to say:
poll
by Meyer London Friday, Jun. 02, 2006 at 1:47 PM

I'm sure that everyone who follows this board will be attending those public Torah readings, but to get back to the subject at hand, it seems to me that the poll reveals a degree of anti-Arab prejudice that would surpass in intensity any poll of anti-semitism in today's Europe - including states that were fascist or allied with Germany and Italy in World War II. I sort of reminds me of the sad fact that abused children often grow up to be abusers themselves. I'm not saying that the victms of the Holocaust were children (except for the actual children), but the psychological transformation from victim to victimizer is strikingly similar.-

then, 'goated Jew' responds w/o benefit of spam
[ you wizards at the tec end...]

-You don't need to resort to smartmouthed forms of verbiage to frame your contention. You come across quite clearly as an antisemite, even if not of the card carrying variety. An antisemite faulting the Israeli Jews (as if they're all "European" rather than split down roughly evenly between such and non-Ashkenazi) for having become more uppity than they were in their classic victim roles.-
******
please forgive this interruption.

Seriously -- got any intentions to retract the statement you made labeling the early Zionist Ashkenazi immigrants to the land of Israel as "White Europeans"? Or maybe some second thoughts about that racist label? And why do you insist on implicitly referring to all Israeli Jews as European Jews/white Europeans?

They were in fact white Europeans, so there is nothing wrong with describing them as such, or pointing out the obvious absurdity of the claim that they had some kind of right to take land away from Palestinians because their biological ancestors supposedly lived there thousands of years ago.

It is being used with an unmistakable intent to deliberately conjure up the host of negative connotations it evokes in today's mostly politically correct public life *in addition* to juxtaposing it -- at least implicitly -- with a supposed fully indigenous *non-White* population.
When it comes to the local Arabs of that period, they were mostly non-indigenous *and8 mostly white. Ashkenazi immigrants were Caucasian and so were the local Arabs for the most part. This is what's wrong with or at least misleading about applying the "White Europeans" label to those Jews _when juxtaposing them against the "Palestinians" of that era_.

Further, as far as I can tell, no one in these quarters has tried to claim Ashkenazi immigrants had a right to rob local Arabs of land. You're still shadowboxing against a stawman you created yourself. You needed to do that as you couldn't completely backpedal from your genetic miscencptions. BTW, my sister-in-law's nuclear family consists of 4 siblings. Many ultra-Orthodox couples produce way more than two children, too. Doesn't mesh with the claim you made about the Israeli Jews making two kids at most per family.

I'm glad you have seen the light, Mr. Scapegoated and I assume that this means that you believe that the Israeli settlements on the West Bank and in Gaza have to be abandoned, as well as the Golan Heights. The infamous wall, of course, will have to come down where it is built on Arab land or where it separates the homes of Arab farmers from their fields. And, of course, in a two stage pull-back, Israel will return first to its 1967 border and then, after a year or so, to the land that was allotted to it in 1948. All Arab families who were driven out of that area in 1948 and not allowed to return will be generously compensated. Then, of course, when Arabs make up the majority of the population in this 1948 style Israel in a few decades and vote in a government that wants to abolish the apartheid Jewish state and give Arabs equal rights with Jews you would be against the use of any violence aimed at preventing then from doing so. When you confirm all this I will agree that you and your zionist friends are against stealing Arab land. I won't be holding my breath while doing so, however.

Unfortuantely you're the one who's shrouded in darkness here and seem quite proud of it. You haven't backpedaled from the insinuation that the Israeli Jews are "European"; you're parroting this mendacious propagandistic "Berlin Wall" refrain, yadda yadda, ngah ngah cluck cluck.

Your 1949 Armistice-Lines-as-future-permanent-Israeli-borders vision may well materialize within the next 2 decades now that someone like Olmert and his flock of cretins and degenerates are in charge. After all many Israelis have proven themselves to be certifiable impatient fools by voting them in to power. There's no more quality leadership in Israel these days. Yossi Beilin's political platform may well end up implemented and win the day.

The parrotization of lies in your spiel, what with the same familiar unfounded faith-based predictions and biased concern for Palestinians alone is simply dismissed as the same ol' crock it'll always be. I'm not trying to gain your stamp of approval any more than I've tried to gain the infamous antisemite Lee Doyle's affirmation for anything.

Hey, Nessie (Patrich?)
Think we're stalking you?

We just about are, yeah.

Scared?

Good idea.

Because we are rough, tough and socially unacceptable

Oh wait, that's you.

I know you enjoyed our little visit last time- are you ready for a repeat?

Looking forward to seeing you, sweetheart! Let us know when you'll be around, so we don't have to leave our calling card.

Much Love,
Tia and charismatic megafauna

An ISM member's father speaks out:

The ISM is a cult and not to be tolerated




In 2003 I began writing exposes on the International Solidarity Movement (ISM). The ISM was originally set up by leadership of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP ), the primarily Christian Arab and communist wing of the PLO, with Yasser Arafat's blessing in 2002. It was designed to ally with foreign anarchist and anti-capitalist groups in the West in a common goal of making worldwide revolution that
would include the dismantling of the Jewish state of Israel as a top priority. George Rishmawi, one of the ISM founders, felt that exposing foreign nationals to Israeli counter terrorism forces along with any injuries that might occur would make the world "sit up and take notice" of the Palestinian cause of destroying Israel and replacing it with an Arab dominated state.?


The ISM began a campaign of trying to aid PLO terrorist groups and eliciting support abroad by claiming they are a
"peace group." Privately, their message was always different: support revolution and act as human shields for terrorist groups opposed to the existence of Israel. In the US, the ISM developed a presence in almost every major city usually working in conjunction with campus Palestinian groups supported by the Muslim Students Association. The ISM has no centralized leadership or location, following past revolutionary movements by having multiple cells and entities so that if one is closed down the others can continue to operate. In so doing, the ISM has become a cult, where the word "peace" in the Middle East is merely a code word for promoting worldwide anarchy and revolution, the end of Israel and the goals of terrorist groups..


I started an organization called Stop the ISM after I attended undercover some ISM national conferences. In doing so, I and many volunteers all began exposing the ISM for what it really is: a terrorist protection movement bent on first the destruction of Israel and then the United States and a propaganda arm of terrorist groups on US college campuses. To date our activities have managed to get over 200 ISM troublemakers deported from the West Bank, and just recently the main money laundering arm of the ISM came under scrutiny of the IRS so they had to stop collecting donations tax free that were costing the US government a fortune in lost tax revenue
and ultimately went to organizations associated with Hamas.?


If anyone doubts the definition of the ISM as a cult, they have only to read a letter that follows from a parent of an ISM activist, Brian Malovany. Brian is high up on the ISM food chain. He was discussed extensively in my article about how the ISM trains human shields to aid terrorists in the West Bank. A year ago, Brian Malovany's father contacted me through the Stop the ISM website and asked if there was any way I could keep his son from the West Bank. Being concerned parents they were worried he might be killed to become a propaganda tool like Rachel Corrie and Tom Hurndall. The parents of Rachel Corrie and of Tom Hurndall instead of warning other parents to discourage their children from acting as human shields for Arab terrorist groups but instead became mouthpieces for them. Had they been decent parents they would not have allowed their children, anarchists by their own definitions, to go and act as human shields in combat zones for the likes of Yasser Arafat and Saddam Hussein. But Brian Malovany's parents are good and loving parents, they recognize that the ISM is a cult now, a cult that promotes terrorism and unending war against Israel and the United States.


I was asked last year by Brian Malovany's father if there was any way I could help keep their son out of the West Bank. I replied back then that it was a daunting task for anyone to stop a 36 year-old man from doing anything, but I was moved by Brian's father's distress over his son and what he was doing with his life. I sent a photograph to the Israeli police authorities with a copy of my article in which I exposed him as an ISM trainer. I told how he directed ISM volunteers to not stop Palestinian children from throwing stones even thought we were allegedly "peace activists" and how if we encountered armed terrorist groups we would have nothing to fear because the ISM worked with such groups and the word would be put out in advance not to harm us.. I was advised by the Israeli authorities that his picture was in a computer used at
border entries along with his name to prevent him from getting into the West Bank. I also made an agreement with Brian Malovany's father: I would keep our correspondence confidential. I understood the anguish of a father who wanted to keep his son out of harm's way but did not want to seem to be against him.


Now, a year later, much to my surprise, I received another letter from Brian Malovany's father. It seems Brian had managed to get into Israel yet again and had been? running around with the ISM on the West Bank for the last six months. How could that be? Was Israeli security so lax? His father explained that Brian has an Irish passport, besides his American one, with which he might have fooled the Israeli border control.


Brian Malovany is currently living with Paul LaRudee, the Northern California head of the ISM about whom I've also written extensively, another player and trainer high up on the ISM food chain. LaRudee once boasted about sleeping in the bed of a suicide bomber in the West Bank.




Brian Malovany at ISM training session.


The letter below from Robert Malovany, Brian Malovany's father, illustrates how the ISM is not just a political movement, but a nihilistic cult that destroys families and seeks to also destroy civilized society while telling everyone it's a "peace group." Brian Malovany is a prize cow in the ISM also because he's of Jewish descent but? works to aid the ISM in its work to aid those who murder Jews in the Middle East. Read on:



I thought I would give you an update on our situation with our son
Brian. As you might have expected, our relationship has gone
from bad to worse.

We had hoped that we would have some warning when he
was going to go back to the West Bank with the ISM.
It didn't work out that way.
Before he left, he quit his job and went on a 6 month
trip with his girlfriend. He was following her around helping her to
write a book about red state America. They were trying to
figure outwhy the rest of America felt so differently about
things than people in the Bay Area.
To make a long story short, as soon as he got back to SF,
he took off for Israel and stayed there for 4 or 5 months
doing the kind of mischief the ISM is famous for.

While there,
our communications got steadily worse.He kept
sending us political B.S.
He knew we didn't want this stuff but he sent it anyway.
Interestingly, we stayed in contact with his girlfriend.
She tried to be understanding, but clearly she felt abandoned
when he took off for the West Bank.? Israel/Palestine is not
her cause.
Gradually she realized that he had become absorbed in a cult
(ISM).
Their relationship foundered and he continues to blame us
for this.
This is particularly sad as she is a nice person. But he
really did abandon her choosing anti-Israel activism

over their relationship.
The ISM cult really has a hold on him. She decided wisely
to leave him and get on with her life.
While in Israel, he pulled another typical ISM maneuver. He
visited a cousin of ours on her Kibbutz.He stayed with her
and her family for a few days, took advantage of her
hospitality, and then went back to his friends on the West
Bank.
Clearly he used his family relationship to extend his visa
in Israel. So there he was being all charming and friendly
with our cousin and using her hospitality in order to
extend his
stay in Israel while working with an organization
which is committed to the annihilation of her country.
Nice!
Now he is back in the Bay area and apparently staying with
Paul LaRudee, not one of your favorite people. He bypassed
us on his way back and we have had very little contact with
him since. He knows we aren't pleased with his current
activities and life choices. He probably thinks we are
evil fascist racist Zionists. What else is new?

It appears less and less likely that we will ever again have
a civil relationship with our son.
He really needs help.
Deprogramming might not even be enough. He has cut himself
off from anyone who ever really cared about him, his family,
his girlfriend, and he has made his obsession with ISM
politics the centerpiece of his life.He has no real job
or any prospects.
My guess is that as soon has he can, he will go back to
the West Bank.All that he needs is someone to bankroll him
and people are continuing to give these useful idiots money.
Be that as it may, he is putting his life in danger. He may
not realize
it, but to his Palestinian handlers, he is worth
more dead than alive. He is valuable to the ISM in that with
his Jewish background he can pretend to be Jewish so they
can pretend not to be anti-Semites.
But over there, a nice dead white American martyr would be
great P.R.

So yes, we think he is eager to go back there. In his crazy
obsessed state, his activities on behalf of the 'poor
oppressed Palestinians' give meaning for all he has
sacrificed. We are trying to think of some way we
can stop him from going back.

The problem is we don't know anyone. Clearly he has done
enough mischief over there to get on a do not admit list.
I get the feeling that Israel doesn't much?care to keep these
so called peace activists out. Do you have anyone?we could
speak to in order to keep him from getting a visa. Is there
a security apparatus in existence which is collecting names
of undesirables to keep out of Israel?? If so, wouldn't active
ISM members be logical candidates to keep out?

To make a long story short, is there any way you can help us??

We know that trying to keep him from going back to the West
Bank will not help our relationship with our son, but it might
save his life.
As with our previous communications, I would hope that you
keep this totally confidential. I know you are eager for us
to go public with our problem, but my wife and I are not ready for
that. As unrealistic as it might seem, we still have some
hope of someday again having a relationship with our son.
It may be hard to believe, but he was once a really nice guy.

I tried to track down the Geocartographia for the Centre for the Struggle Against Racism for more information on what demographics they used. I couldn't find any substantiating information. I did find this poll widely posted on IMC's all over.

But no verifying information. We need to know how many people were polled and during what time period. We need to know the margin for error. Israel has 9 million people. WHO was polled? What was the methodology?

I for one am not willing to accept these results as a given until they have been verified with substantiating information.

My guess is the pollsters were highly partisan and the "results" have been concocted.

Still, i would like to see a similar poll conducted among Palestinians to learn how they would answer similar questions. We may be surprised to find the Jewish Israelis are MORE tolerant of their would-be murderers than the Palestinians are of Jews.

I mean the Torah does not call Arabs "the sons of pigs and apes."

Actually, if the poll were more accurate it might include attitudes among Israelis that are even more negative. See the book My Enemy, Myself by Yoram Binur, an Israeli fluent in Arabic who disguised himself as an Arab to find out how he would be treated in Israel. He found out - like a piece of crap.

REPLY TO MEYER LONDON: Compared to what?

Did he disguise himself as an Arab and infiltrate Palestinian culture to document what the general Palestinian attitude is towards Jewish people?

Any society has resident racism among its populace. The contention is that the Israelis are MORE racist generally towards Palestinians (you know, the people who keep sending in suicide bombers) than other peoples.

At least they are the only ones being examined.

A white writer in the '60's disguised himself as a black and went into the deep south to document racism against blacks in a book called "Black Like Me."

But what does Judaism teach about how Jews should treat Arabs? It not only teaches tolerance. It teaches human responsibility for the suffering of others.

How does the Israeli govt. treat Arabs in Israeli courts and government bureaus? Its' my understanding that they are treated without prejudice as a matter of enforced policy.

How do the schools and textbooks treat Arabs and Palestinians? They teach tolerance and promote peaceful co-existance.

"Did he [Yoram Binur] disguise himself as an Arab and infiltrate Palestinian culture to document what the general Palestinian attitude is towards Jewish people?"

Yes he did. In one setting I recall, he assumed the name "Fathi `Awwad" and lived among day laborers. He even had his life threatened by a drawn knife at one point when a suspicious "companion" demanded he cite the Quran's first Sura to prove he's a bonafide Muslim. Firtunately he had memorized the text and passed muster.

away one to be counted on to conflate & lie.
- Judaism teach about how Jews should treat Arabs?-
We are talking about Israelis, Not Judaism.

Something you try so hard to associate zionism with. To their grave endangerment as they reap the 'blowback'.
So... did you ever state that your 'work' here @ LA IMC was w/o compensation of a material nature?
Or are you on the zionist payroll?

The question was not whether Israelis are more hostile to Arabs than Arabs are to Israelis. The poll was discussed as evidence that Israel is not the haven of tolerance, advanced thinking and political sophistication that it and its apologists make it out to be.
I remember the part of the book where the author was afraid he was going to be knifed. He was afraid that the Arabs would conclude that he was an undercover agent, provocateur or assassin. Not an unreasonable assumption, given the history of Mossad thugs.

"... their grave endangerment as they reap the 'blowback' "

How can my/our lives become more jeoperdized when racist anti-Zionist haters like you and worse keep bellowing their vile spew at me/us? Do you *really* fear for our safety or is it a phony gambit on your part? If you avoid a direct reply I'll assume you're not genuinely concerned about Jews that way.

then It's nothing I've had anything to do with.
It would be the results of the policies of zionism. And the Jews would be blamed for it.

Sounds like you hold an impossibly high standard for Jews ---and even though they are assaulted several times daily for BEING Jews----they are not allowed to harbor any prejudice against their would-be murderers?

And you ---judging from the safety of a Western democracy, are ready, willing, and able to blame the Jews for not being progressive enough?

You have NO standards for the Palestinians who you defend no matter what they do.

What the hell are you flapping your 'lips' about, Ms. BJ?

--and even though they are assaulted several times daily for BEING Jews---

Where? by who?
Maybe by you, constantly conflating zionism the 'Jews.'
Ms. self appointed hufjeden.
And I don't believe a word you've typed.
But I have it for evidentiary purposes.

typo
Ms. BJ, the self appointed hufjuden.

Your only weapon is vitriolic hatred, Mr. huf-nazi. You must have taken a few leaves from a neo-Nazi book during your sojourn in Germany decades ago. The jackboots now fit you.

The dog has evaded my question from Jun 3 at 3:45 PM. He effectively reaffirmed his racist Jew-hating credentials.

okay let's examine these comments..

Think you're scaring me/us?
by Scapegoated Jew Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 3:45 PM

"... their grave endangerment as they reap the 'blowback' "

How can my/our lives become more jeoperdized when racist anti-Zionist haters like you and worse keep bellowing their vile spew at me/us? Do you *really* fear for our safety or is it a phony gambit on your part? If you avoid a direct reply I'll assume you're not genuinely concerned about Jews that way.
My reply

if you're scared of blowback
by Judasgoat's imp Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 5:15 PM

then It's nothing I've had anything to do with.
It would be the results of the policies of zionism. And the Jews would be blamed for it.

then Mr. 'goated 'Jew' response.

The following post has status hidden:
That's a cowardly cop out
by Scapegoated Jew • Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 6:07 PM
You've reaffirmed your racist Jew-hating credentials. Would be you soon meet your karma. Damn you for eternity

Then my response

The following post has status hidden:
have you set a date?
by Judasgoat's imp • Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 6:10 PM

Mental illness..
***
if you're scared of blowback
by Judasgoat's imp Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 5:15 PM
then It's nothing I've had anything to do with.
It would be the results of the policies of zionism. And the Jews would be blamed for it
****
That's a cowardly cop out
by Scapegoated Jew Saturday, Jun. 03, 2006 at 6:07 PM

You've reaffirmed your racist Jew-hating credentials. Would be you soon meet your karma. Damn you for eternity.
****
'nuf said...

[ so I believe that I've answered your question ]

He's still evading my question from Jun 3 at 3:45 PM.

holy shit.
Just scroll up.

SHEEPDOG WRITES: "--and even though they are assaulted several times daily for BEING Jews---
Where? by who?"

BECKY: Where? In cafes, on busses, in college cafeterias, at train stations, in restaurants, at Passover dinners, while walking down the street, in pizza parlors, at little girl's birthday parties, at grocery stores and shopping malls. That's where.

Who? Islamic Jihad, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Fatah, Tanzim, PFLP, PLO, Hizbullah, Al Qaeda, and by teenagers going down daily to pelt rocks at IDF soldiers.

"Afik and Yosefov and the more than 1,000 other innocent Israelis who have been killed in terror attacks in the past four years, all died because Palestinians bent on our destruction have tossed aside diplomacy, preferring to use violence as the means of achieving their goals."
--Michael Freund in the Jerusalem Post June 29 2004

"The Al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades have received money from Hezbollah to fund terror attacks, members of the Palestinian militant group revealed in an interview published Sunday." ---from Haartz April 3, 2005

"reports suggesting that Hizbullah was offering thousands of dollars to Fatah gunmen to carry out attacks on Israel. It also reflects growing tensions between Hizbullah and the Palestinian Authority over the decision to suspend terrorist attacks against Israel." -- from The Jerusalem Post Mar 31 2005

"Security forces arrested Musa Bader, 27, the head of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine infrastructure, in Nablus late Sunday night.

According to officials, the same infrastructure was responsible for the Carmel Market suicide bombing in Tel Aviv several weeks ago, as well as a string of other attacks."
---from the Jerusalem Post Dec 6 2004

BECKY: You are kidding, right? You aren't actually saying that you are unaware of the estimated 21 daily attempted attacks on the Jews by various Palestinian armed gangs?

conflation again between pro-ported anti-semitism worldwide and resistance in the form of guerilla warfare in response to occupation and the usual IDF rampages are really not the same thing.

The ''estimated 21 daily attempted attacks' on 'Jews' ( their occupying oppressors, because Ms. BJ cannot use the word 'Israelis' as she, like the other weasels must paint the crimes of zionism in 'Jews' to hide among them despite the fact that she can't speak for all Jews...) are, if valid, reaction to decades of injustice and grief you are unable to share any blame with.

What sets you apart from your pal 'nessie' is how you're more crass at expresgiving vent to your racist vitriol. You both are have arrested emomtional development and need to grow up.

'goated 'Jew' is upset.
Talk about vitriolic rhetoric. Maybe this is why.
I made a mistake. Mark your day book.
I thought Ms. BJ was referring to * international* anti- Judaism.
not resistance guerilla fighters and suicide bombers...

My bad.

Upon closer examination of your crypto-Nazi spirited ravings I see you're casting my Jewishness in doubt, surrounding the Jew in singular quotation marks. Hitler would be pround of you. I've never stooped to doubting your own religious affiliation, no matter how scanty it may be. You ought to reap your karma pronto.

of course I'm casting doubts on your 'religion'.
as for my religious affiliations, I wasn't aware of any.

You believe me to possess pure Khazarian genes? Or is it a pure Slav lineage? Perhaps an admixture of these?
Anyway, it should be expected from a crypto-Nazi fuckwit like you to insist that my religious identification is dubious whether my genes are wholly Israelite or wholy non-Israelite.
The ultimate sin that disqualifies my Jewishness in your eyes is defense of anything Israeli or a smidgem of Zionist identification. Thanks for revealing to us all your rabid bigot mentality. I postulate that Tia too has realized this and accordingly lost hope of guiding you toward the light and the righteous path. You're bound too tightly to the slime you rather splash in by a mammoth array of emotional rewards to let go of it.

a mistake perhaps w/ a little help,,,
one or two down....
by Judasgoat's imp • Sunday, Jun. 04, 2006 at 3:33 PM

awwww Tia gave up on me.

And so...I should feel bad?
I can tell you feel bad. And cranky.
Aside from that, what the hell was that spray all about? You don't make a lot of sense normally but sheesh...

I'm a what?
-a crypto-Nazi fuckwit -your rabid bigot mentality -to the slime you rather splash in-
wow.
Good thing I didn't mention that you talk more like the SS than a rabbi.

"awwww Tia gave up on me. "

Sorry. Busy weekend. I don't give up so easily.

doesn't Judasgoaat talk more like a SS than a rabbi?

Sheepdog- you'd be a more pleasant person if you had more more sleep.
I think our Israeli friend is at his most effective when he discusses history and facts. As an Israeli he has a unique perspective and has access to information (in its orginial language) that we may not have.
I'd prefer us all to stick to facts and information instead of personal attacks and one-upmanship. (except against Nessie, of course)

Well, Tia he *does* come across as a SS. And not the religious 'Jew' he claims to be. I care little exactly how much he can quote text or provide his particular historical detail or facet, of to my personal, view inconsequential psycho babble and animosity towards someone who cares neither if someone is a 'Jew' or not. I only care about ending the insanity that threatens all of us with its enablers and liars.
And the constant accusations of me being a 'nazi goose stepper' come off rather hypocritical from such a source.

I don't really sleep.
And nessie together with me agree on 99% of issues.

I've seen why he holds his views and is correct about IMC being used as a tool for racists by your and other anti-human sects.

i don't believe he claims to be a "religious" Jew- he regularly posts on the sabbath and on holidays (as do I). Only Yid doesn't.
People often make the assumption if you identify strongly as a Jew and support Israel that you are a "religious fanatic". Its simply not the case. I've been called a religious fanatic too, although I regularly violate about half of the ten commandents, and don't know enough of the other 613 to know how many I neglect.
And, ironically enough, I agree with Nessie on many issues, although I'd nevr admit it to his face because he is a raving asshole and an smug, self righteous evil petty man.
Damn! see- now I'm engaging in personal attacks. Oh, well. So much for the moral high ground.

1st you wrap yourself in Judaism and then you say 'it don't matter' If we are discussing a religious faction which is the only 'glue' the zionists use to justify their 'rightful possession' and anguish from being a 'Jew' to Palestine.
Okay here's how
I see it.

Your a Jew when it's convenient and a zionist when necessary...

"Your a Jew when it's convenient"
I am always a Jew. Until the day I die, and perhaps beyond...
I am just not a religious Jew. I'm not particuarly well educated or observant.


"and a zionist when necessary..."
I am always a Zionist. Until the day I die. I define Zionist as one who believes in the right of the jewish people to self determination in their ancient homeland. Even when I don't agree with the policies of the Israeli government, I still support the right of the Jewish people to self determination in Israel.
Does that clarify matters?

"but that's not the point I was making"

Suffice it that you've got a pointy racist pin head.


"Well, Tia he *does* come across as a SS. And not the religious 'Jew' he claims to be."

'Sheepdog' is an exquisite representative of the crypto-Nazi avant garde in the rabid anti-Zionist Left in America, notably insomuchas they specialize in inverting reality and projecting their most odious qualities on their enemies. That's how a neo-Nazi at heart can charge a Jew of any level of Zionist identification of acting or seeing like an SS member and simultaneously maintain he/she presented themselves as a religious Jew with a straight face. These scum have taken the art of lying to hitherto unseen heights. No wonder whatsoever, is there, that he'd make the following statement in almost the same breath:

" I only care about ending the insanity that threatens all of us with its enablers and liars. "

Those familiar with his cyber writings would most likely puke at reading this line if they had just eaten too much of the wrong foods.
And the mendacious followup will leave no such readers astounded at all:

"And the constant accusations of me being a 'nazi goose stepper' come off rather hypocritical from such a source"

He knows he wouldn't have been able to milk enough sympathy from the occasional reader if he presented my contention verbatim. A "crypto-Nazi goosestepper" or a "goosestepping neo-Nazi at heart" is too distant from the catchy sounding "nazi goose stepper" label to elicit a reader's sympathy because the reader just might suspect the former labels contain a grain of truth.

not only is it that you don't agree w/ me but you don't very strongly.

Not only the Bible spam reappears, but 'toady' had earlier spammed his fake and out of context Zionist quotes. Suggests he had a rough time today and has come to LA-IMC to vent his frustrations.

While the poll results don't surprise me, the conclusions re: "racism" are quite wrong. Whats reflected is an accurate perception that Palestinians are hostile and dangerous, particualrly towards Jews. This is easily confirmed in two ways, first, thats what the Palestinians tell us is their intent. Then, it is what the Palestinans have been doing. It would be foolish and naive to expect Jews to disregard their experience and survival instinct and to sit around and sing "Kumbaya" while the Palestinians are electing Hams and promising to kill any Jew they can.

While the poll results don't surprise me, the conclusions re: "racism" are quite wrong. Whats reflected is an accurate perception that Palestinians are hostile and dangerous, particualrly towards Jews. This is easily confirmed in two ways, first, thats what the Palestinians tell us is their intent. Then, it is what the Palestinans have been doing. It would be foolish and naive to expect Jews to disregard their experience and survival instinct and to sit around and sing "Kumbaya" while the Palestinians are electing Hams and promising to kill any Jew they can.

While the poll results don't surprise me, the conclusions re: "racism" are quite wrong. Whats reflected is an accurate perception that Palestinians are hostile and dangerous, particualrly towards Jews. This is easily confirmed in two ways, first, thats what the Palestinians tell us is their intent. Then, it is what the Palestinans have been doing. It would be foolish and naive to expect Jews to disregard their experience and survival instinct and to sit around and sing "Kumbaya" while the Palestinians are electing Hamas and promising to kill any Jew they can.

While the poll results don't surprise me, the conclusions re: "racism" are quite wrong. Whats reflected is an accurate perception that Palestinians are hostile and dangerous, particualrly towards Jews. This is easily confirmed in two ways, first, thats what the Palestinians tell us is their intent. Then, it is what the Palestinans have been doing. It would be foolish and naive to expect Jews to disregard their experience and survival instinct and to sit around and sing "Kumbaya" while the Palestinians are electing Hamas and promising to kill any Jew they can.

Interesting. What I have found out by going into chat rooms and talking to people(well, mostly horny men) in Israel, Egypt, Iraq, India and Australia is that the people who are really hard-core anti-semites and seething with Jew-hatred, have never met a Jew in their lives. Whenever I was able to engage in dialogue with (albeit) English-speaking Arabs and/or Muslims, who were filled with invective against the Jews and Israel, they invariably could not relate a single experience they had ever had with a Jew.

Hopefully the internet will help penetrate the very closed Arab society. I've often said, that in order to plant the seeds for world peace, we should drop Nintendos and game packages down to Arab children.

Its easy to hate a face-less enemy who is constantly villified in schools, textbooks, in Mosques, and on PA television. That is the case with the average Palestinian.

For the Jews, they are sick and tired of people trying to kill them.

Is it Bradely Allen the heavy handed deleter? 'fess up facist.

poor quality spamming

Jews expressing their own opinions. Yup, indybay editors can't stand that! Its weird for an editor of one indy site to post spam on another, but its never stopped Nessie.

...but desires it's practice. Here is a picture of what 90% of all Jews are like. The only credit to their race is that 5% of them call for the liberation of Palestine.

You take one of the most extreme, and in fact shunned by the rest of us, viewpoints and post a picture of it's obviously fanatical racist supporter. Should I do that with anti-Zionism, equate all of them with David Duke (oh right, your beloved sites actually DO link to him)?

And yet they elected left leaning centrist, Olmert, who promised to dismantle West Bank settlements and expell Jews from their homes. How do you reconcile that?

Transfer is the ugly word that is rarely spoken. Some members of Women in Green have called for the transfer of the Arab population out of its borders and into neighboring Arab/Islamic countries. It is NOT the majority opinion in Israel and isn't spoken of very often even by WIG.

However, the sign holder does have a point. Anyone remember 1948, 1956, 1967, and 1973 when the Arab armies combined to attack Israel?

If you read the charter for Hamas, they call the Jews "the enemy." Likewise, the PLO charter also refuses to recognize the right of the Jews to a State, no matter how tiny, in the mideast.

Palestinian Arabs preach hatred of Jews and Israel with breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Many Palestinians and many USA "Peace" groups advocate for the transfer of all Jews currently living in the West Bank to be removed or transferred against their will.

I am opposed to involuntary transfer of either Arabs or Jews. People will remember that the ONLY involuntary transfer of any people has been of the Jews from Gaza last August/Sept. I don't see why Jews can't live together in peace with the Palestinians if a State of Palestine is ever formed. Arab Israelis have been living in peace with Jews in Israel since 1948!!

Oh, look, another "anti-Zionist *wink wink*" antisemite.

No, fuckwit, the extreme whacko in the photo does _not_ represent "90% of the Jews", any more than your overt antisemitism represents 90% of progressives.

@%<

"I am opposed to involuntary transfer of either Arabs or Jews. People will remember that the ONLY involuntary transfer of any people has been of the Jews from Gaza last August/Sept. I don't see why Jews can't live together in peace with the Palestinians if a State of Palestine is ever formed. Arab Israelis have been living in peace with Jews in Israel since 1948!!"

Soveirgnty, independence, self-determination, etc...this is what both sides want. The way to best serve these interests is creating two independent states where these peoples can each have their self-determination. Compromises have to be made, Israel had to give up the Gaza. Truthfully, withdrawl from the territories is beneficial for the IDF, as well. What about those soldiers killed guarding settlements of a dozen settlers?

It's nice and all to think that the settlers should be treated well when the IDF left, but you know as well as I that they would be attacked. I can imagine it myself, the people that I have been taught are the oppressors, and in fact some of the most extreme of their group, with reports of them provoking Arabs in the territories...of course they're going to be attacked! Now, I'm all for their right to choose to stay...but they have children! Those kids deserve to get back to safe land, preferably not orphans.