WHY ALHAMBRA?

Why is Alhambra being targeted by their racist-hate agenda? Why is SOS coming to Alhambra this time? Alhambra is one of the most diverse communities in the entire state. The SOS website reveals much about their motives and reasons. A website banner promoting the SOS Alhambra demonstration states, “Alhambra – Ghettoway to the San Gabriel Valley.” Alhambra has also been referred to as a “cesspool” on the SOS site.

Everyone I know that lives in Alhambra considers it a nice place to live.

The main organizer of the SOS Alhambra demonstration, who claims to live in Alhambra, has already attempted to intimidate some of the local day laborers. He says this: “Taking pics of the illegals made them very nervous,” and, “I couldn't help yelling, ‘Viva La Migra!’ as I drove by.”

After musing on about the changing demographics in Alhambra (the National Vanguard, a white-supremacist group which attended the SOS rally in Victorville Saturday, is also opposed to changing demographics) and some racist references to “white flight” from Alhambra the SOS organizer goes on to say, “I've had friends come down to visit and comment that they could not tell what country they were in.”

Is the fact that Alhambra is not a fully assimilated community part of the problem for SOS? Is it a problem for them that there are shops which cater to Asian clientele and have signs posted in Chinese or Vietnamese and that Spanish is spoken in on the sidewalks of Alhambra?

To quote Leslie from a post on indymedia earlier this week, “white Americans have never finally imposed their civilization on others. White racism is the manifestation of that failure.” Why else would a nice town like Alhambra be considered a “cesspool”? An SOS member also laments, “This is our country… it is temporarily enemy occupied territory.”

The SOS organizer also adds “I see these Mecha/Aztlan clowns in Alhambra regularly. They are always young, from late teens to early 20s, shaved heads, a few tattoos, the normal thing you would expect from such dirt bags.”

He also states, “There are a couple of Mechistas on the city council and I dislike them intensely.” Who is he referring to here? Why does the SOS refer to every brown skinned politician as a Mechsita?

Well, the only liberal on the Alhambra City Council is Alhambra Mayor Daniel Arguello, who is a graduate of the University of La Verne and a Vietnam Veteran and Purple Heart Recipient. Why is Arguello considered a “mechista”? To my knowledge the University of La Verne does not even have a Mecha chapter. Further, Arguello lists his greatest sources of pride as “to have served my Country with honor and serving my community as a public official.” Why is he being targeted?

(see Arguello’s bio)
http://www.cityofalhambra.org/government/city_council/second_district.html

Does the SOS do any homework before making their claims? Or are they simply, “trying to tap into this seething anger,” as SOS founder Joe Turner states. The same kind of anger that has it’s root cause in the internalization of fear and confusion.


WHAT CAN WE EXPECT FROM SOS IN ALHAMBRA

The SOS also has been kicking around various tactics and ideas that might be used in Alhambra on Saturday.

One idea is as follows: “Someone [could] dress up in a Mexican outfit with a huge sombrero and go around begging to everyone "Pleeeeeasssee Senior, let me come to your country, and ruin it". Or maybe this idea will be effective, “What about a defaced Mexican flag with a big red X marked over it?”

At a prior SOS rally at a Home Depot site in Laguna Beach they were heard referring to immigrants as “vermin” and “disease carriers”.

This bazaar remark was also lifted from the SOS board, “The Chinese food in Alhambra basically SUCKS!”
(SOS website)


THE SOS MUST BE OPPOSED IN ALHAMBRA THIS SATURDAY

Anti-racism activists and community supporters will be arriving at 8am on Saturday June 18 to stand in solidarity with the day laborers who will be under direct attack from the SOS. The address is 500 S. Marengo Ave. in Alhambra (between Atlantic and Fremont, North of Mission)

Please come out and support this community demonstration and stand against racism, immigrant bashing and scapegoating and stand up for the rights of all working people.

NYC Jumbo and MPV Seafood in Alhambra are fine. Also, Noodle World is good, but not Chinese (it is Thai and pan-Asian).

The Dumpling Master in the Shun Fat shopping mall is also in Alhambra (across from Happy Family Vegetarian), I think. The border with Monterey Park runs through that area.

Also, vegetarians should check out Vege House on Valley near New, by the bowling alley. They have the fake veggie meat and the fried mushroom "chicken".

Ooooh - I almost. If you're low on cash, there's this place called Kang Kang near the Starbucks across from The Hat. It's good grub for cheap, and they always put the Lakers on the big screen.

I'm not an expert on the cuisine, but I like these restaurants.

These SOS yahoos do not know what they are talking about. They must have eaten at the Panda Express next to the movie theater or the new Pick Up Stix next to the Kohls.

Alhabra has some of the best Asian Cusine in all of Califas.

Video tape the Minutemen and SOS and submit it to Americas Funniest Videos.

They remind me of those loonies in the movie "Viva Max"

Alhambra and the city next to it, Monterey Park has the best Chinese food in California. I have friends throughout America and they want to stop by Alhambra and Monterey Park for chinese food. Actually you can check out the L.A. times food section to find out where to go. writing this want to go there for chinese food. I think I will...

If immigrants are such a drain on teh economy then explain this quote from Alan Greenspan:

"Alan Greenspan informed Congress that immigrants, including undocumented workers, in essence donate $27 billion to state and local economies. This is the difference between what they pay in taxes ($70 billion) and what they use in services ($43 billion)."

http://www.ailf.org/pubed/pe_articles_nw062102a.htm

I can explain Greenspans comments. These figures only refer to illegal aliens who are working. They do not take into account the cost impact of their children. In California, Hispanic immigrants (the majority who entered illegally) have an average of four children.
http://www.ppic.org/content/pubs/CC_801HJCC.pdf

When the costs of these four children are included, illegal aliens costs California taxpayers $9 billion a year
http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=2570&c=13

I am sure some of you will say "but when these children grow up they will pay taxes". Yes, but unless they all graduate from college and earn $50,000 a year, they will never repay the large investment made in them, which includes financing this investment with deficit spending.

As for the article cited by Chop Chop, it is by the American Immigration Lawyers Association, so of course they are only going to present figures that helps their pocketbook with increased immigration.

It's all about money, these immigration lawyers don't care home much illegal immigration costs American taxpayers, as long as they can make a few dollars more. Maybe everyone here on Indy Media does mind paying more in taxes to support illegal aliens, but 91% of Americans do not. http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/050305_poll.pdf

Is the US still a democracy or not?

Let me set some people straight here. Yes, I organized this protest at Home Depot and yes, I know the mayor. The mayor is a very intelligent, civil man and I have deep respect for him. I dont consider the Mayor a Mechista. However, there a few guys in local office who seem to espouse the Mechista attitude of reconquista and the La Raza ideology.

Yes, Alhambra is multi-cultural and multi-ethnic and I find nothing wrong with that. Seeing how I am not White, I could care less. I've lived here long enough to get along with everyone.

My problem is with the growing illegal alien presence at Home Depot and obviously Home Depot's support for open borders and their racist hiring policy.

You have misrepresented the nature of this protest. Save Our State will have its share of non-white protesters as usual so rant all you want. You have always been wrong and you will continue to be wrong on this issue.

Hey Pachuco, do you want to see some real clowns that would look good on a terrorist training video? Here is some footage from Baldwin Park you thugs like to pretend does not exist.

BUSTED:

http://www.kirkbytv.com/Teaser1_15fps.wmv

http://www.kirkbytv.com/Teaser2_15fps.wmv

http://www.kirkbytv.com/Teaser3_15fps.wmv

Oops, you all got caught acting like animals now didn't you?

Pick Up Stix is actually decent. I've tried 6 different Chinese restaurants around here and if I had to grade them the best would only get perhaps a C +. Its my favorite cuisine so its a bummer that this city doesn't have better Chinese food.

Anyway, Alhambra is not known for its cuisine. Cuban Bistro is about as good as it gets. Mahan is decent also.

At any rate. We are coming out for a peaceful demonstration agasint the corporate, racist, anti-American whores, Home Depot. We plan on behaving just like we promised the police in the telephone conferences we had with them. They are well aware of your past history at prior rallies so mind your P's and Q's.

Also, we made it very clear to any potential White Supremacist group that they are not to associate with us. Their presence is not expected but just in case they were to show we'll have them come stand with you Indy Media geeks since you both share racist ideologies.

SOS organizer,

How do you know the day laborers at the Alhambra Home Depot are "illegal"? Wouldn't anybody be uncomfortable if a stranger started taking their picture in public?

How would you feel if you were in their shoes and were trying to care for you family by looking for work in that manner and somebody arbitrarily came by and took your picture? If their breaking the law then call the police whom you claim to have such a good relationship with. Do you realize that those guys are human being too?

As far as the references to "mechistas" on the city council. Who are they? Name them if you're going to make a claim. Arguello is the only Latino on the council and you say you weren't referring to him. Who then?

It seems like you are making unverifiable claims and somebody finally called you on it. You claim the other side uses lies but look at what you're doing.

Hey, i will need some good Chinese food after the Protest...I will personally pick it up for riot helmet boy if he will join me at pick up sticks at about say 1230- 100.

We were just talking about were to get some food, and it was my idea to get chinese. Since the org knows about the food in that area, we said skip the chinese becuzz its mostly no good in that area.

Ok, so we do thai ! Fine with me. Hey, 1p1p, you like green curry ? Come to lunch with us !

Firstly, I don't need to be explaining ANYTHING to the whack jobs who support Indy Media. This site is full of lies, distortions and diseased propaganda. One can believe almost nothing of what comes out of here.

Now, about the day laborers. Its common knowledge that nearly ALL day laborers are illegal aliens. Oh and I have had my picture taken MANY times by counter-protestors and I don't wince. If you are covering your face like these guys are, what are you guilty of?

And don't give me this sympathetic nonsense about their plight - we know the story. I support secure borders and I oppose ILLEGAL immigration and that means I support the LAW. I don't like the fact that greedy employers exploit these peasants either, which ultimately keeps them on the bottom rung of the socio-economic ladder. This is not a race issue, as badly as Indy Media wants it to become one. I'm not White, and many of our members are not White either so any attempt at branding this organization as racist is futile and childish.

What makes you an expert on the city council? I had a run in with one of them a couple of years back. Perhaps that individual is not on the council anymore, I honestly don't know. What I do know is that a recent city council meeting in Alhambra revealed they are concerned and upset that Save Our State is assembling in Alhambra which leads me to concur that they have the same misconceptions about this organization as many others do, due thanks in part to the lies of Indy Media. I have written the Mayor to explain the realities behind our stance and our presence.

I'm signing off for now and I don't see much reason to continue to entertain challenges from Indy Media propagandists. There is little integrity to be found here. You can freely read what we talk about on our site. If you are coming to the rally then we will see you there. Our intent is a peaceful exposure of Home Depot's corrupt business practices and has nothing to do with Alhambra as a city or its legal residents. I've lived here for years and watched these day laborers grow in number and that ties directly into what this organization is about - getting the LAW enforced, which I know you oppose. No level of propagana, lying or attempts at intimidation are going to stop us. Our mission is noble, our mission is LAWFUL and just.

I got a link to a racist website, and they had a lot of stories up there that were similar to what the SOS and MMP are saying. Well, they pretty much were about the MMP and copycats like SOS, so, that's why they sounded the same. The rhetoric and arguments are pretty much identical too -- legality, disease, public costs, culture.

They even had the kirbytv videos, and stories about BP up.

Isn't it nice to know you all have admirers who also happen to be fans of Adoph Hitler?

can you link the site ??

The City's concerns more likely stem from the fact that the last city you all protested in led to the City Council getting death threats.

The moderate faction within your group is not the problem. You might be deluded about this Pandora's Box you're opening up, but, you aren't the ones making the death threats.

The problem is that within your group, even after the so-called "bans" of white supremacists, there are still people who basically harbor racist views. Moreover, when you all take political action, you attract nazis. Your group and the nazi groups are creating a shared platform, and the moderates seem to be unaware of this.

The fact that you are not white does not give you a "pass", nor does your token status in this far-right nativist movement give the movement a "pass" on the accusations of racism. The accusation is not against you. It's partly against the group, and partly against the border issue. It's mainly against the political actions you take, which serve to play into the current mobilization of the facist right nationalist groups.

Congratulations.

It's called "White Revolution" and seems to be like an Indymedia of the WP scene, except there's no "newswire".

A C+? You're being really picky. It's not as good as what you can find in Monterey Park or San Gabriel, but it's still good. You have to go to the areas closer to SG and MPK.

You know what Alhambra really needs? It's a branch of Taco Nazo from Baldwin Park (your fellow "cesspool" municipality that's in your gunsights). That place has good tacos. They even have a photo of Zapata on the walls. (They also have a photo of stacks of money too. That's kinda weird.)

The Akaka Bill Could Give Birth to the Nation of Aztlan.

Hawaii is in the process of passing a bill that will create a new sovereign nation within the borders of the United States.

The criterion is the based on “GENETICS” or traceable lineage of anyone who qualifies according to the established definitions as “Hawaiian.” This bill will allow Hawaiians to lay a claim to the ceded lands of Hawaii.

That will set the precedent for Mexicans who were forced off their land in 1848 to have a similar claim to Aztlan.

=====================

Loans for Mexican Nationals offered by USDA to purchase rural property in USA.

Washington -- Eligible Mexicans in the United States will have access to U.S. rural development programs under a new partnership agreement signed by the U.S. and Mexican governments.

Source: http://usinfo.state.gov/wh/Archive/2005/May/16-257607.html

==========

JOHANNS AND DERBEZ SIGN PARTNERSHIP TO PROMOTE USDA RURAL DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS

MEXICO CITY, May 13, 2005 - Agriculture Secretary Mike Johanns and Secretary of Foreign Affairs for Mexico Ernesto Luis Derbez Bautista today signed a partnership arrangement to improve access to USDA rural development programs for eligible Mexicans in the United States.

"This partnership is the continuation of the firm cooperation established with the USDA, to inform and encourage qualified Mexican Nationals to take advantage of the benefits offered by rural development programs," said Derbez. "Within these programs, USDA loans and grants for housing contribute to the enhanced well being of eligible Mexicans who would otherwise not be able to own a home or improve their living conditions. This partnership is one of the actions developed by the Foreign Affairs Secretary to engage in promoting better conditions for Mexicans living in the US."

Source: http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_1RD?printable=true&contentidonly=true&contentid=2005/05/0161.xml

LOL - Aztlan dot Net is not recognized by the Chicano Movement as a valid representative of Aztlan.

The people at Voz de Aztlan are equal in stupidity as FairUS, CIS, CCIR, Voices of Citizens Together/American Patrol and your other friends. Source: http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?sid=175

Neo-NAZIs join SOS - Source: http://www.splcenter.org/intel/hatewatch/item.jsp?hid=714

This is the real Voz de Aztlan: http://www.0101aztlan.net

http://www.diversityalliance.org/docs/press_2005mar21.html

From Diversity Alliance for Sustainable America. Who is not listed by SPLC.

By the way, Vietnamese are insulted by being called "yellow". Vietnamese have golden skin.

JohnK, you really need to give this Nazi nonsense a rest. It illustrates your lack of credibility and sense of paranoia. You Indy Media dwellers live on a diet of lies and propaganda.

I know all the major players in SoS. If I thought for a second there were facist or racist leanings in this group I would abandon it.

Your side still has failed to address their own blatent racism. Your minions here practice Mexican Nationalism on American soil and that does not sit well with American citizens. All my neighbors are Hispanic and I can guarantee you that none of them subscribe to your support for "Aztlan" or a dissolving of the border between the US and Mexico.

As far as Baldwin Park, it revealed the reconquista mentality and the anti-American hatred that exists among leftists, globalists and separatists - all types found right here at Indy Media. Seeing what we saw, you cannot blame the survival instinct that develops when you see foreign flag-waving hatemongers all around you stomping on the US flag, telling you to get off "their" land and accusing you of genocide.

This assault on our country and our citizens will not go unanswered.

The main thing I don't like is your tactics. It's the chickens*** tactic of going directly after day laborers.

You say you go after Home Depot for thier relationship with the National Council of La Raza but many, many other corporations have similar relationships.. Why Home Depot? What you guys really want to do is harass day laborers.

Just admit it and stop spending all your time calling your opponents racist.

Judy Baca says the line on the monument which states "it was better before they came" was made by a white man but SOS and their supporters don't believe her.

Why then is the entire SOS message and movement based around the idea of "it was better before they came".

You guys should love that statement...

It was better before [Save our State] were here.

That's a 20 plus mile bike ride for me one way so I'll be unable to attend, alas.

>>It was better before [Save our State] were here.<<

Was it better because you could make more money by hiring illegal aliens, at the expense of American workers?

Or was it better because you could make more money working illegally in the US, at the expense of American workers?

Or maybe you were looking forward to the day when California completely turned into Mexico North?

> Its common knowledge that nearly ALL day laborers
> are illegal aliens.

Translation: I can't back up my outragheous claims with reason or evidence so I'm going to spew insanely and cry about some imagined left-wing Indy Media conspiracy and hope nobody notices I'm utterly incapable of and unable to address SOSMM's racist hatred which enjoys the support of the ANaziP, Storm Front, National Alliance et al.

What's also telling is that this unfortunate problem capitalizes the word "white." Check just about any white supremist web site and they do the same illiterate thing -- like it's a noun. That's telling. (The denial of being white is left as an exercise for the class to examine and evaluate on their own.)

Funny: Indy Media is here and available for anyone to post to and yet this right wing kook wants to pretend it's some how "full of lies" which he can't actually name. At the same time racists and such ilk get their lies posted on Indy Media openly and freely just like normal people's postings, and they get debunked and exposed soundly -- so obviously it's something wrong with Indy Media, not the racists.

No, the propblem such scumbags have with Indy Media is that they can't censor it and are forced to try to defend their ideologies openly without turning off their intellectual and moral superior's microphone once the truth starts. That's what right wing kooks hate about Indy Media, looks like to me.

My opinions, all, of course.

> JohnK, you really need to give this Nazi nonsense a
> rest. It illustrates your lack of credibility and sense of
> paranoia. You Indy Media dwellers live on a diet of
> lies and propaganda.

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/news/item.jsp?aid=13

Woops! Caught the SOSMM liar in another lie, huh?
Now the right wing kook _could_ try to claim that the Southern Poverty Law Center forged the interviews and the photographs and that the Nazis who support, applaud, defend, and participate with the SOSMM hate mongers were actually actors hired by the SPLC, yet the rest of us -- those of us with IQs above 80 -- will accept the available evidence after giving it critical thought.

But this is also telling in another way: One of the reasons why Christianity has the bloody history that it does is because they refuse to accept that it was and is Christians committing their atrocities.

One of the reasons why pedophilia among CXhristian clergy across the board manages to survive in epiudemic -- or indeed pandemic -- levels is because Christians refuse to accept the fact that it's Christian clergy committing these crimes.

Along comes the SOSMM racists who point at their Aryan Nations, American Nazi Partty, National Vanguard / Alliance et al. members, supporters, defenders, participants, and all the hundreds of terrorist death threats spawned by the SOSMM racists -- and they deny that it's SOSMM's responsibility.

Then we get the following:

> I know all the major players in SoS. If I thought for a
> second there were facist or racist leanings in this
> group I would abandon it.

Apparently it's enough that the white males _he_ is familiar with aren't driving vans into crowds of peaceful protesters, and it's enough that the white males _he_ is familiar with aren't wearing Nazi symbols out in public where he can see them.

The fact that his fellow SOSMM clowns are out there virtually indistinguishable from all the other white supremists Christian groups out there is apparently utterly irrelevant.

You know, once they used to hide under hooded robes but this time around the methodology includes creating factions and fractions, some of which operate as covertly race hate motivated, some of which operate overly race hate motivated. Deniability then factors into the equation, as does the available body of evidence and the widespread use of media to convey the evidence.

While the SOSMM scream about some how not being racists, the denials... Well there's a concept of credibility about such claims, metered against falsifiable evidence and it looks to me like SOSMM's claims are easily debunked.

DISCLAIMER: I suspect that a number of SOSMM cloowns actually do think they're opposing racism some how and that their message isn't one of abject hatred and bigotry. I suspect that some of them -- a few; certainly the massive minority -- _are_ solely opposed to just _illegal_ aliens.

The majority of the SOSMM and its followers, supporters, defenders, and participants? From the available body of evidence I've seen, it's all no different than the usual white supremist rhetoric and activities America has been plagued with since Europeans came to North America.

It's also curious. I've seen a lot of SOSMM disclaim any involvement with the endless racist and white supremists groups and individuals that join them, and I've seen the SOSMM clowns pretend to "ban" such overt, obvious groups and individuals. But I've yet to see anyone from the hate cult activelky condemn the American Nazi Party, Aryan Nations, National Alliance / Vanguard, Storm Front and all the others that spew the same rhetoric as SOSMM.

Why doesn't the SOSMM post a public denouncement against white supremicy on their web sites (if indeed they don't.) Why don't we find anywhere on any SOSMM web site a comment like, "White supremist racists are unamerican and traitors to the dictates of the Constitution from which the liberties of America depend?"

Could it be because they would lose 99% of their support?

My opinions only, as usual, predicated upon what I read about these clowns.

Before, and in spite of, SOS you would see nothing but bright shinny happy people in BP.

We all were doing great, we could focus on our children, our community and our lives without the “would be slave master’s cracking whip of hatred”.

That's what SOS and their friends represents – hate.

You want to make sure that we discard our roots and dispose of any evidence of our existence.

We have fought in every American war since the American Revolution to the current war in Iraq. We built the Cowboy Culture that defines most of the American culture. Not one mention of this is in the history books our children study in school.

Now you want us to tear down a monument because you say it is seditious, when the reality is that you want to prove that a handful of Anglos can enforce their will over an entire community of Hispanics.

A power trip, that's all it is. Control over a people you consider inferior. A group of people you will never except as Americans.

We own America as much as anyone else and we have to right to express our American experience as it happened to us – not the way you want to define it by denying your acts of bigotry and genocide.

The monument stays!

Now, just leave. Go back to your “bankrupted by Anglo corruption” Orange County.

You make me sad, Freddy. I guess 20 miles on your little communist-red trike is too far, huh? Ever heard of something called a CAR, Fred? Or did that drunk driving conviction put you out of business?

We'd love to have you at the rally, you can even leave your straightjacket at home.

Alas, we'll cope I am sure. There are no shortage of left-wing, radical, extremist, open borders, racist, terrorist goons among your ranks. Your separatist, Nazi-like, Mexicronies will make you proud with their uncivil behavior, I have no doubt.

QUOTE: By the way, Vietnamese are insulted by being called "yellow". Vietnamese have golden skin. END QUOTE

Chicanos did not come up with the term Yellow for Asians, since we share a common ancestor our skin colors are similar - golden.

All people are really brown in varrying degrees.

P.S. Were you in the ARVN?

Pachuco,

Thanks for the explanation.

By the way, I live in the San Gabriel Valley. I think SOS is going after the wrong target by protesting this monument.

But I do support their action against Home Depot.

>>>A power trip, that's all it is. Control over a people you consider inferior. A group of people you will never except as Americans.

>>>We own America as much as anyone else and we have to right to express our American experience as it happened to us – not the way you want to define it by denying your acts of bigotry and genocide.

>>>The monument stays!

Pachuco, that was very well put..

You call me paranoid, and, I agree to some extent that I do have an overactive imagination and sometimes do get tripped out... but please explain the death threat phone calls to the BP city council and Judy Baca, the National Aliance nazi contingent that showed up to support SOS in Victorville, the Nazis who were all over the SOS boards, and the Nazis who write glowing stories about the BP incident.

These things have happened.

Also, here's my explanation of our opposition. We are a diverse group of people united by our common interest in stopping SOS. We don't all agree politically 100%, and we have divergent premises -- the response you're experiencing is an alliance to deal with the immediate issue at hand. What I write here are my own opinions, not any group's.

Likewise, I don't take responsiblity for what anyone else says. Many of us do try to calm the situation down, though. The fact that our side didn't completely trample yours in BP showed some restraint.

--------------------

If you want paranoid, I'll give you paranoid. What's up with the name "Joe Turner"? It seems a little too "perfect." I heard someone joke that it's the "Joe Turner Diaries", about what's going on.

The "Turner Diaries" is a fictional book, written by a fascist, about a guy who helps start a race war. I think the term was "racial holy war." It's a "classic" in the American fascist and racist scenes. If you click around on their sites, you eventually find it.

Could you imagine if he had a name like Miczlekowski? That might be motivation to change the name to something media-friendly, for the movement. And what better name than "Turner" for what he's doing?

(So, being a geek, I did the usual thing and looked SOS up on WHOIS.)

Domain ID:D104730891-LROR
Domain Name:SAVEOURSTATE.ORG
Created On:07-Aug-2004 00:56:11 UTC
Last Updated On:15-Nov-2004 17:10:58 UTC
Expiration Date:07-Aug-2005 00:56:11 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar:Tucows Inc. (R11-LROR)
Status:OK
Registrant ID:tugfPusxiZmVz9pl
Registrant Name:Save Our State Save Our State
Registrant Organization:Save Our State
Registrant Street1:PO Box 3031
Registrant Street2:
Registrant Street3:
Registrant City:Ventura
Registrant State/Province:CA
Registrant Postal Code:93006-3031
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.1231234567
Registrant Phone Ext.:
Registrant FAX:+1.0000000000
Registrant FAX Ext.:
Registrant Email:stoptheinvasion@yahoo.com

Oh well, he just used completely fake information all over the thing. That's real leadership.

All this trouble is happening, and all these Nazis are popping up everywhere. It's suspicious.

------------------------------

There ya go. Your daily dose of paranoia.

SOS, the Minutemen or any group that really has the intent to address the USA immigration problem would gain more support if they stopped using certain words, if they went after the real source of the problem and if they severed all affiliations with race supremacy groups.

I agree that Voz de Aztlan at www.aztlan.net is a shock-jock narrow-minded bigoted organization, just like FairUS and American Patrol and CIR; and that Ernesto Cienfuegos is as hateful a person as Rush Limbaugh. Those guys just want to make money by instilling fear in vulnerable people.

There is no Reconquista.

La Raza is no more racist than the term Average Joe. It is a Pachuco term meaning the common people.

Mecha is a college right of passage - members become productive members of society after graduating from college.

Aztlan is an attitude of self-empowerment. It instills in us the desire to pull ourselves up by our own bootstraps.

You should applaud us, not ridicule or obstruct us from trying to master our lives.

Don't come to Baldwin Park. Leave the Day Labor sites alone - many that benefit from those are legal residents and citizens. Don't deny us our heritage by opposing multiculturalism.

Form a protest against the real culprits that lie to us and sell out our jobs and I will support you.

It is once again hypocrite racist Fred Rice taking it!

that is a good one, that we can not prove that 99 % of day laborers are illegals! Just like we say all the time...you would say that the sun is not in the sky too. That is basically what you are saying when you say that...amazing.

Oh, btw, the chicken tactics you refer to puch dude are basically are what works at the moment.

Why home depot ? Well, how many can you go after at one time? We had to pick one...and HD and the day laborer centers scream the loudest. The level of human exploitation they cause is off the scale.

Oh, i forgot, you dont want to hear that illegals are exploited by those that we protest, it makes us look good and like we are one with you....sshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

I think when you start talking about how much undocumented workers "cost", you have to balance it with the amount of goods and services they produce, rather than the just taxes they pay.

(I suspect that while the newcomers pay little in taxed, the established people pay a lot more, even if it's paid fraudulently under fake SSNs.)

You have to figure in the actuall value of what they produce, because the profits they generate are also taxed (and at a higher rate), and sales of goods are taxed. The additional economic activity also turns into job opportunities for people in supervisorial and managerial positions.

See you got my message wrong. SOS seems to get everybody's message wrong. I meant It was better before SOS were here in L.A. Indy Media. I have no idea why SOS is being an ultra trolls in this site.

About 3 weeks ago I tried to register and post on the SOS message board and was banned within 10 minutes and can no longer access thier board from that computer.

I din't use any foul language and was completely rational and was banned. "Joe Turner" doesn't like dissent. It's funny that SOS people say indymedia is biased when they are free to post on here just like anybody else. The same doesn't go for their message board.

We are not only going after the day workers, at Home Depot

We are going after the traitors who hire them.

You have to start somewhere.

Once again!!!! THE MONUMENT IS JUST A SYMBOL, in Baldwin Park.

It represents, all of the bull**** Americans have had to put up with, when it comes to the illegal Mexican invasion of our country.

Illegal Mexicans have no right to be here, and they must leave.

Everything in America was great, before illegal Mexicans started invading our country.

They must be punished for breaking our laws. We do not believe you to be inferior. We believe you to be equal. You must be punished for breaking our laws, just like all Americans are punished.

Punishment for entering our country, is immediate deportation. If you do it enough times, you will never be allowed to become a legal American citizen.

It is not just Baldwin Park or California, that battles are raging on about illegal Mexican immigration. Battles are being fought all across America.

There will be no peace, until all illegal immigrant invaders have been deported and punished.

The marxist left is a cancer to Western Civilization.

Lawlessness was another byproduct of the "sexy 60s" and the Worst Generation has a lot to answer for.

Lowlifes only obey laws when "it feels good."

Maybe we should deport anyone who aids and abets illegal immigrants as well.

Please chill on the overblown, self-aggrandizing self-protraits. It's unpleasant enough to read you without having your ego in my face. You are not good-looking enough, interesting enough, or charming enough to warrant the bandwidth, despite what you think "Mirror Mirror" is telling you.

You seem to suffer from delusions of adequacy, Morongun.

I'll TELL you when you're making sense. Otherwise, you won't know.

To the rest of you who go only by the book's cover, good for you.

The allegorical skulls of my idealogical enemies can attest to the price you'll pay for underestimating my unrivaled genius.

I wake up delighted to be me. I wonder if you can say the same.

RXG

What was your handle?

You got me... I'm John Riley...

something of note for johnk and others. It may offer some insight as to why SOS is targeting the SGV.

***TAKEN FROM WHITEREVOLUTION.COM***

Invasion: Fallen Cities

Top 100 American Cities with Highest Percentage of Foreign-Born Residents (pop. 5000+)

Cracking the top 50 are:

24. Rosemead, CA - 56.1%
34. Monterey Park, CA - 53.5%
43. San Gabriel, CA - 51.9%
44. El Monte, CA - 51.4%
45. S. El Monte, CA - 51.4%
48. ALHAMBRA, CA - 50.9%
84. Baldwin Park, CA - 45.7%

>>Chicanos did not come up with the term Yellow for Asians, since we share a common ancestor our skin colors are similar - golden. <<

Then why is a Chicano artist using the term "yellow" people? Also, I though Chicanos considered themselves "Bronze". I also think most African-Americans don't consider themselves brown. Which is why a few were apparently upset they weren't included in the quote.

>>P.S. Were you in the ARVN?<<

No, I missed it by a few years. But my uncle was ARVN, MIA, my brother-in-law was ARVN, KIA. Another brother-in-law was NRVN, 10 years re-education camp, 4 years refugee camp.

I suggest that you venture beyond this paltry space to discover other worlds where the wisdom of your pronouncements and beauty of your visage will be given their due reverence.

While you're at it, be sure to kill a few natives -- it worked for me.

Columbus

Dear Clodumbass,

As Jesus went where the sinners are, so I come to this foul socialist website to deliver the RIGHTeousness of the truth.

Nay, all the leftists that form fists with one hand while the other extends palms up for a handout should run and hide like the craven demons they are.

I understand your jealousy. Several leftists have already inquired where I get my "look." I tell them just to do the best they can, though t they won't do better than this 10th degree black belt.

A Frightening Analysis

We all know Dick Lamm as the former Governor of Colorado. In that context his thoughts are particularly poignant. Last week there was an immigration-overpopulation conference in Washington, DC, filled to capacity by many of American's finest minds and leaders. A brilliant college professor named Victor Hansen Davis talked about his latest book, "Mexifornia," explaining how immigration — both legal and illegal — was destroying the entire state of California. He said it would march across the country until it destroyed all vestiges of The American Dream.

Moments later, former Colorado Governor Richard D. Lamm stood up and gave a stunning speech on how to destroy America. The audience sat spellbound as he described eight methods for the destruction of the United States. He said, "If you believe that America is too smug, too self-satisfied, too rich, then let's destroy America. It is not that hard to do. No nation in history has survived the ravages of time. Arnold Toynbee observed that all great civilizations rise and fall and that 'An autopsy of history would show that all great nations commit suicide.'"

"Here is how they do it," Lamm said: First to destroy America, "Turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual and bicultural country. History shows that no nation can survive the tension, conflict, and antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures. It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse for a society to be bilingual. The historical scholar Seymour Lipset put it this way: 'The histories of bilingual and bi-cultural societies that do not assimilate are histories of turmoil, tension, and tragedy. Canada, Belgium, Malaysia, Lebanon all face crises of national existence in which minorities press for autonomy, if not independence. Pakistan and Cyprus have divided. Nigeria suppressed an ethnic rebellion. France faces difficulties with Basques, Bretons, and Corsicans."

Lamm went on: Second, to destroy America, "Invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage immigrants to maintain their culture. I would make it an article of belief that all cultures are equal. That there are no cultural differences. I would make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are due to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other explanation is out of bounds.

Third, "We could make the United States a 'Hispanic Quebec' without much effort. The key is to celebrate diversity rather than unity. As Benjamin Schwarz said in the Atlantic Monthly recently: 'The apparent success of our own multiethnic and multicultural experiment might have been achieved! Not by tolerance but by hegemony. Without the dominance that once dictated ethnocentrically and what it meant to be an American, we are left with only tolerance and pluralism to hold us together.'"

Lamm said, "I would encourage all immigrants to keep their own language and culture. I would replace the melting pot metaphor with the salad bowl metaphor. It is important to ensure that we have various cultural subgroups living in America reinforcing their differences rather than as Americans, emphasizing their similarities."

"Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this second underclass have a 50% dropout rate from high school."

"My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations and business to give these efforts lots of money. I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of 'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think their lack of success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry blaming all minority failure on the majority population."

"My sixth plan for America's downfall would include dual citizenship and promote divided loyalties. I would celebrate diversity over unity. I would stress differences rather than similarities. Diverse people worldwide are mostly engaged in hating each other - that is, when they are not killing each other. A diverse, peaceful, or stable society is against most historical precedent. People undervalue the unity! Unity is what it takes to keep a nation together. Look at the ancient Greeks. The Greeks believed that they belonged to the same race; they possessed a common language and literature; and they worshiped the same gods. All Greece took part in the Olympic Games.

A common enemy Persia threatened their liberty. Yet all these bonds were not strong enough to over come two factors: local patriotism and geographical conditions that nurtured political divisions. Greece fell.

"E. Pluribus Unum" — From many, one. In that historical reality, if we put the emphasis on the 'pluribus' instead of the 'Unum,' we can balkanize America as surely as Kosovo."

"Next to last, I would place all subjects off limits ~ make it taboo to talk about anything against the cult of 'diversity.' I would find a word similar to 'heretic' in the 16th century - that stopped discussion and paralyzed thinking. Words like 'racist' or 'x! xenophobes' halt discussion and debate."

"Having made America a bilingual/bicultural country, having established multi-culturism, having the large foundations fund the doctrine of 'Victimology,' I would next make it impossible to enforce our immigration laws. I would develop a mantra: That because immigration has been good for America, it must always be good. I would make every individual immigrant symmetric and ignore the cumulative impact of millions of them."

In the last minute of his speech, Governor Lamm wiped his brow. Profound silence followed. Finally he said, "Lastly, I would censor Victor Hanson Davis's book Mexifornia. His book is dangerous. It exposes the plan to destroy America. If you feel America deserves to be destroyed, don't read that book."

There was no applause.

A chilling fear quietly rose like an ominous cloud above every attendee at the conference. Every American in that room knew that everything Lamm enumerated was proceeding methodically, quietly, darkly, yet pervasively across the United States today. Every discussion is being suppressed. Over 100 languages are ripping the foundation of our educational system and national cohesiveness. Barbaric cultures that practice female genital mutilation are growing as we celebrate 'diversity.' American jobs are vanishing into the Third World as corporations create a Third World in America — take note of California and other states — to date, ten million illegal aliens and growing fast. It is reminiscent of George Orwell's book "1984." In that story, three slogans are engraved in the Ministry of Truth building: "War is peace," "Freedom is slavery," and "Ignorance is strength."

Governor Lamm walked back to his seat. It dawned on everyone at the conference that our nation and the future of this great democracy are deeply in trouble and worsening fast. If we don't get this immigration monster stopped within three years, it will rage like a California wildfire and destroy everything in its path, especially The American Dream.

See who links to KIRKBYTV.COM

AltaVista found 10 results

Save Our State

The Welch Report

Patriotic Music. Ron Paul's Liberty Committee. American Opinion Books and Flags. Radio Liberty, Dr. Stanley Monteith


Americans for Legal Immigration Forums-viewtopic-U.S. BUREAU OF IMMIGRATION and CUSTOMS ENFORCEMENT Help Fight Illegal Immigration



Mexicans or Terrorists? - The Battle for Baldwin Park - TEAM AMERICA PAC
Founded by Congressman Tom Tancredo: The Defense of a Nation Begins at It's Borders


Sean Hannity Discussion - Minutemen vs MECHA/Aztlan Movement - America at War Minutemen vs MECHA/Aztlan Movement. Wonderful people, huh?



LP: Must See Video of Baldwin Park Riot
Liberty Post: Must See Video of Baldwin Park Riot




Baldwin Park riot by illegal aliens screaming 'go back to Europe', May 14, 2005 - THE AMERICAN RESISTANCE FOUNDATION


Baldwin Park rally video
"I attended the Baldwin Park event as a news videographer for an independent program. The
coverage we obtained was incredible, thanks to you folks. We were particularly impressed by the fellow screaming "Zarqawi! Yes! Yes!" and "Intifada!"

freerepublic.com





http://KIRKBYTV.COM was running Apache on unknown when last queried at 17-Jun-2005

11:26:48 GMT


OS Server Last changed IP address Netblock Owner
unknown Apache/1.3.26 (Unix) 17-Jun-2005 66.218.89.139 Yahoo



We have no uptime data for KIRKBYTV.COM at present, and cannot plot a graph.

The host KIRKBYTV.COM has been added to the list of sites that we may monitor. We will start monitoring KIRKBYTV.COM in the next daily monitoring cycle.

We will continue to monitor this host for a few days, to get enough values to plot a graph. After this time the host will not be monitored again unless it's requested again, or it is one of the most frequently requested hosts.

RICO RICO RICO


http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gang16jun16.story

--snip--
O.C. Raid Takes Out Local Leaders of the Mexican Mafia, FBI Says
By H.G. Reza, Times Staff Writer

A task force of 300 police officers launched early morning raids throughout Orange County on Wednesday, serving 40 warrants and capping a two-year investigation that authorities said could topple the Mexican Mafia's drug dealing enterprise in the county.

Officers arrested 24 people, including Peter Ojeda, 63, a La Habra resident identified as the ranking Mexican Mafia soldier in Orange County. Ojeda controlled the drug trade of local Latino street gangs, using violence and strong-arm tactics to keep underlings in line, authorities said. He is believed to have run a criminal organization for about 30 years. But the crimes attributed to the defendants allegedly occurred this year and in 2004, said Richard Garcia, assistant FBI director in Los Angeles.

Ojeda and the others were charged under the federal Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act. United States Atty. Debra W. Yang said the case marked the first time that defendants were charged under RICO in Orange County.

The federal law is commonly used by prosecutors to go after organized crime figures. The Mexican Mafia is a powerful prison gang that authorities say controls drug distribution and other illegal activities in Latino communities in Southern California.

Twelve other defendants in custody on unrelated charges also were charged in a three-count indictment unsealed Wednesday. The racketeering charges include allegations of drug trafficking, extortion, assault and murder.

In addition to dismantling the so-called Ojeda Organization, authorities also arrested members of the Santa Ana-based West Myrtle Street Gang.

The investigation was spearheaded by the Santa Ana Police Department's Gang Task Force and Career Criminal Unit.

Santa Ana Police Chief Paul M. Walters said the probe and the sweep were conducted in near secrecy by federal, state and police investigators who worked from police headquarters.

The FBI's Garcia said the arrests "took out all of the main leaders of the Mexican Mafia" in Orange County

Let's ban Saint Patrick's Day, Columbus Day, Oktober Fest, Madri Gras, Martin Luther King Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving, Christmas, Ash Wendnesday, Valentines Day, United Nations Day, Halloween, National Europeans month, Hispanic month, African-American month, Asian month and Native American month - these all promote multiculturalism.

What is the American culture anyway?

Cowboys - Mexican

Rock and Roll - African-American

Railroads - Asian

American Revolution - English, Spanish-Mexican, Native American, African America and French.

People want Americans to forget that this is a nation of immigrants, that there were millions of people here when Columbus landed and that only White people contributed to the building of OUR Nation.

False Race Supremacist LIES ! ! !

The responses I received for offering unity was answered with hate. Who is really the destructive force in America?

We went from Golden to Brown to Bronze to describe our skin color.

My best friend was ARVN.

I salute your ARVN family - heros in my book.

I didnt realized that Joe Turner from SOS has been interviewed by the White Revolution. SOS supporter, what do say about this?

> we can not prove that 99 % of day laborers are
> illegals!

Translation: The unfortunate clown can't back up the notion that day laborors are all illegal aliens so he spins and spews in the hopes nobody notices.

I wonder where these Republicans get their notions. They seem to think that anyone who stands on a street corner looking for work is ipso facto in the country illegally. Some other racist glibly proclaimed, "it's common knowledge" and yet couldn't back his hate up with a suitable, falsifiable reference.

It's _possible_ that a percentage of the people who perform day labor like this are in the country illegally, without a doubt. The claimants have yet to produce any evidence to back up their claims that 99% or 100% of them are.

So we get insane, illiterate, IQ=80 kook rants instead.

EXCERPTS FROM SOS SITE:
JOE TURNER: "The gist of it is that the City of Baldwin Park (as a result of last nights vote) now requires anyone planning a protest where they expect more than 35 people to pull a permit."

1 Inch: "Could be the number was chosen to protect SOS and keep the opposition at bay. Most counts had SOS at under 35 at the first rally and the opposition way over."



1 Inch: "Not quite sure how to react to that. We didn't have 35 people there SOS. The Mechistas did....so in theory..."

STEVE BROW: "We shouldn't have to pull a permit if we have only 10 confirmed"

My first reaction to reading this was that now Joe Turner and his SOS crew are saying that they had less than 35 at the first Baldwin Park demo. What happened to "50 patriots violently attacked" as it says on the SOS front page? You guys are liars and you know it.

Second, SOS should be glad for this since it prevents counters from surrounding them again, this time with several thousand from the community.

Third, they only have 10 confirmed coming to BP?? No wonder they are collecting gas money to try to bring people in from out of state. Wow, Turner (or whatever his real name is) is really is building a movement.

EXCERPTS FROM SOS SITE:
JOE TURNER: "The gist of it is that the City of Baldwin Park (as a result of last nights vote) now requires anyone planning a protest where they expect more than 35 people to pull a permit."

1 Inch: "Could be the number was chosen to protect SOS and keep the opposition at bay. Most counts had SOS at under 35 at the first rally and the opposition way over."



1 Inch: "Not quite sure how to react to that. We didn't have 35 people there SOS. The Mechistas did....so in theory..."

STEVE BROW: "We shouldn't have to pull a permit if we have only 10 confirmed"

My first reaction to reading this was that now Joe Turner and his SOS crew are saying that they had less than 35 at the first Baldwin Park demo. What happened to "50 patriots violently attacked" as it says on the SOS front page? You guys are liars and you know it.

Second, SOS should be glad for this since it prevents counters from surrounding them again, this time with several thousand from the community.

Third, they only have 10 confirmed coming to BP?? No wonder they are collecting gas money to try to bring people in from out of state. Wow, Turner (or whatever his real name is) is really is building a movement.

rabid anti-American socialists, anarchists, Brown Berets, and Mechistas.

One person even hurled a full water bottle at our side and sent one of our activists to the hospital with bleeding in the brain.

suffered inner-cranial trauma when she was hit with a bottle thrown by the Mexicans...


This was not about Illegal Immigrants



terrorists dressed as Mexicans... or are they Mexican terrorists?

-------------------------------------------------------------------
also they claimed 500/50 (they were outnumbered10 to 1) and that the "police could no longer assure our safety so they *escorted* us away until the "riot" dissipated"

Obviously they didn't expect such a strong reaction/turnout so they are trying to spin this into as good of light as possible for themselves.

Right-wing hate groups are all over these people plus I read *talk radio* is to blame for it flaring up in the first place.

(they lack imagination and drive, they depend on the reach of corporate mass media PR to get any kind of movement going to begin with, and the demographics consist of a very narrow/small part of society - persons of limited IQ who are easyly swayed to whatever the puppetmasters want them to hate today while distracting yet another segment using thier own weakness against them - AND US - so we are distracted by defending ourselves. And the real enemies sit back and laugh while raking in profit...)

. . . isn't real. In fact, a quick Google search shows that Dottie is the only person every diagnosed with it.

Maybe she claims she had "cranial trauma"--a blow to the head.

And good ol' Joe is going to lead them and two Arizona Marines right over the embarrassing cliff.

Why do I think the National Vanguard/Minuteman's next assignment for Joe will be sitting in a lawn chair with his six pack and gun in the winter in North Dakota, looking through his binoculars at the Canadian tundra? Jim Gilchrist would be a fool to let this guy strategize a kindergarten nap.

You'll see her saying she's fine at first, looks like they decided to make a big deal out of it for publicity, she was talked into allowing them to call an ambulance , then the typical oxygen deal then better go in for x-ray/CAT scan just to be sure...

it's extremely likely that it would cause a big stink on the mass media news if it was real..

also what about the protesters the van ran down - that weighs a _bit_ more than a water bottle and they were accused of faking too.. by the very ilk that's exaggerating this

hell it's not even known WHO threw it for that matter but we DO know who hit the protesters with his van...

> Second, SOS should be glad for this since it
> prevents counters from surrounding them again, this
> time with several thousand from the community.

The rule applies to any group that plans on having 35 or more demonstrators. The anti-hate protesters are dozens of small, diverse groups, none of which field 35 or more people. So the rule is pretty much moot; Baldwin Park would need to change the rule to 10 people or more before they could enforce the rule that demonstrators be given written rules of civilized conduct.

In BP1 there must have been 15 or 20 different groups that turned out to oppose raciam hatred and bigotry as well as to oppose another Republican assault against freedom of speech, art, and expression. For BP2 I would hope that even more civil rights and other progressive groups hold their own demonstrations.

We handed the screwballs a humiliating defeat once and now they're trying to save face -- and will once again be soundly opposed by the actual people of this country in overwhelming numbers.

It should also be interesting to see if any arrests of SOSMM members, supporters, defenders, participants et al. have been arrested for the hundreds of terrorist death threats the City of Baldwin Park has received through telephone calls and emails. Maybe someone at the anti-hate rally will have information on FBI arrests.

'Course I don't expect the FBI to arrest any of the racist terrorists since they all will pass the skin hue test, but one can hope!

Speaking my opinions and my opinions only, of course.

> "police could no longer assure our safety so they
> *escorted* us away until the "riot" dissipated"

Love it. A lot of peaceful protesters suddenly become a riot. }:-} What I didn't see mentioned on the SOSMM web site was any mention of the report from the City of Baldwin Park that the racists had assaulted an anti-hate protester with his own camera:

http://la.indymedia.org/news/2005/06/129510.php

Guess that's a world wide left-wing Socialist media conspiracy like all the rest, instigated by Bill Clinton's penis. Or something. }:-}

My opinions only.

You guys are simply letting Save Our State play you like a fiddle.

Save Our State wants you guys to go back to Baldwin Park. They want to capture the idiots on your side stomping on American flags, hurling racist epithets and claiming this land is Mexican land.

I bet Save Our State would pay for Mexican flags so that they could be distributed in your crowd.

Don't you think that Save Our State wants there to be a massive crowd? Don't you think that Save Our State wants you guys to threaten them again as you did on the 14th?

They want to "economically sanction" the city of Baldwin Park. It will cost Baldwin Park thousands of dollars in wages for the police to keep the peace.

When all is said and done, the city will have spent more than the original cost of this monument on two events.

The best thing you clowns could do would be to ignore them and not even show up.

There's an alternative event being prepared at the monument side of the station, for people who would rather celebrate was we stand for, rather than merely what we stand against. People will have options.

Bring your acoustic instruments to jam informally in the area. Performances and poetry are being set up. There's also a call out for more theatrical people to do some teatro. Comedians are encouraged. Contact the organizers at raskache@yahoo.com.


Exist and Resist

I'm all for this "alternative gathering" as I'm curious as to what anti-American Americans (!!!) and their illegal pets really DO represent.

In order for the event be a raging success, make it as Mexicanly authentic as possible.

1) Spanish speaking only!

2) Slaughter of live animals for food, just like it's done in Mexico.

3) Anyone using toilet facilities must throw the used TP in the trash (since the plumbing can't handle it).

4) Addendum to #3: only 20% of the area should have restrooms with plumbing, the rest should be outhouses.

5) Drunken men in ratty undershirts are a must. In fact, 95% of attendees must be drunk, children included.

6) Dirty, neglected dogs and cats must romp through the grounds

7) Grating, hideous "Banda" music chock full of accordions, tubas and bass drums must be bellowed from all orifices.

8) Unshaven police must arrest people who then bribe them for release.

9) People must urinate in the streets at random intervals.

10) The Mexican flag must be flown!

11) A pinata filled with Mexican candy, known for its dangerous contents of lead, must be provided.

12) A few idiots should be provided with guns to shoot off into the air at midnight. At least one child should be struck by a falliing bullet.

13) At least 25 assholes should be wearing "Che" t-shirts.

14) Paved roads must be broken into rubble and dirt and made crooked.

15) A barefoot, dity child should be hawking boxes of Chiclets gum between songs on a toy guitar.

16) Tatooed thugs wearing hairnets should disperse among the crowd, causing random fits of violence of "territory" they don't own.

17) Several toothless old drunks should be stationed at crumbling walls.

18) Drunk driving is to be encouraged, everywhere by everyone.

19) Several "artists" should be blathering nonstop on micro or megaphones. Artist #1 is to put down the United States and brag up how Mexico is superior, Artist #2 should illustrate how "it was better before the White Man came" and Artist #3 shouled be whining for the U.S. Government to give Mexico more aid. A fourth optional artist should be begging the U.S. government for more aid for welfare and money for 'special programs" between cries of 'racism.'

20) Special Guest of Honor: Vicente Bush.




Let me know if I missed anything. It truly is wonderful to EMBRACE DIVERSITY, ain't it?

1) Trash some libs,

2) Throw in a racial epithet about some Arabs or Muslims or Mexicans---its ok to be racist towards them.

3) Mix in some material about how you support "sane" America.

4) Claim to be a moral believing Christian, and the comedy comes full circle. Correct if I'm wrong, but the goal is to educate humanity, not alienate it.


and now for something different:

Vrey intsereting

Tihs is relaly wreid sutff. Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are; the olny iprmoetnt tihng is that
the frist and lsat ltteer is at the rghit pclae, The rset can be a toatl mses, and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter
by itslef but the wrod as a wlohe.... vrey cool !

Show me evidence of any member of SOS or whoever, hitting a person with a camera.

Do you have video?

I bet this is what happened.

The person was taking a picture of the riot, and during the confusion he ran into someone. He hit himself in the eye with his own camera.

Yes, take Voice of Reasons advice and all of you stay away and let SOS get their work done.

The monument must be removed.

Once more, people merely protesting, behind a yellow ribbon, with police all around does not a riot make

Whats cool though is the ratio - 10 to 1

hahahaa

"You're racist" is the best they can do?

Any Mexican honest with himself will admit I've pretty much created a 20-point portrait of life in Mexico + the American barrio.

A true racist would celebrate such misery. I find it shameful, and doubly so that those who fled Mexico illegally would dare pretend their land of corn and corruption is better than America.


1) Trash some libs,

>>>> I did no such thing. I simply described a scene. you must be transferring our own racism onto someone else.

2) Throw in a racial epithet about some Arabs or Muslims or Mexicans---its ok to be racist towards them.

>>>> And for you it's OK to hate Christians and Whites. Maybe you'd like to trade?

3) Mix in some material about how you support "sane" America.

>>>> At least I **support** America.


4) Claim to be a moral believing Christian, and the comedy comes full circle. Correct if I'm wrong, but the goal is to educate humanity, not alienate it.

>>>> Assmimilation IS education. If I went to permanently live in Mexico I'd learn to speak Spanish and adopt its culture as my own. Why should I expect any less from immigrants coming to America?

>>>> A God-hating liberal knows nothing of the true nature of Christianity. or God.


and now for something different:

Vrey intsereting

Tihs is relaly wreid sutff. Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are; the olny iprmoetnt tihng is that
the frist and lsat ltteer is at the rghit pclae, The rset can be a toatl mses, and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter
by itslef but the wrod as a wlohe.... vrey cool !

>>> It's still English.

>>> Consiguo el serivdo.

I was there, I saw her get hit with the bottle, I helped her to sit down, I told the officer in front of me to call an ambulance. Stop listeng to the whackos 1planet1people, Fredic Rice, and most of all the real whack job Duane Roberts. About the van in GG, once again, I was there, the people blocking the driveway were NOT acting peacefully, they attacked his van. As a matter of fact, the car that when in before the had it's rear side window smashed out. Now , I ask you who are the violent people?

Hey man, dont bother telling the truth or trying to reason with ANYONE at IndyMedia. They are all severly mentally impaired and some of them like Fred Rice are completely insane! All of these jokers are immune to logic and TRUTH.

You wasn't there enough to identify the person who threw it

odd


and the list was from a poke at Ann C. - one paste deserves another..

besides you're like clone copies of her - this being the product of allowing other's to do your thinking for you

as a scientist I deal only in fact and data, if you have none to offer THAT'S a waste of time

but wasting other people's time is what it's all about -

{ less the work continues “it’s going to be viewed as just a dog-and-pony show,” said James Gilchrist, one of the Minuteman leaders }



at least he's seeing the light at the end of the tunnel - no ?

What field are you a scientist in, Hex?

We do not oppose IMMIGRANTS!

But illegal aliens!

Are you too stupid to know the difference?

Illegal foreigners will always be hated in the U.S. of A.

Dear 'sick,'

You've nailed it, that's what these negative ninnies are, ANTI-Americans.

They practice weakness to prey on the strong and always blame America first, even when we're battling to destroy islamofascists.

it's a truly sad spectacle, but with out educational system in shambles, we can expect more and more of these liberal "intellectuals" unburdened by facts or logic.

Most of the counter protesters were born here. That's what a lot of the people want to represent -- an inclusive society.

It's really obnoxious how the quasi-fascists go to lengths to claim that their opposition is "illegal aliens" when, in fact, the vast majority are citizens born here.

>>>> Assmimilation IS education. If I went to permanently live in Mexico I'd learn to speak Spanish and adopt its culture as my own. Why should I expect any less from immigrants coming to America?

Aww come on Hexagon, that's easier said than done.

Maybe learning Spanish would happen (though it might not in a border town). Giving up US culture would be hard. If there's a McDonalds or Pizza Hut or Taco Bell around, you'll be there. :-)

I'd have a hard time giving up American music and decent Asian vegetables. I like American style food. I like reading things in English.

I can understand when immigrants stay within their own culture. Life isn't always easy, and changing to a new culture is a lot of work.

Q) Don't they have some version of science and mathematics to help them transcend their animal passions?

A) Most don't even know what science and Mathematics are, and many of the rest think science can only be practiced by someone called a "scientist." --


re: too stupid to to quote

quoted from your own website

"This was not about Illegal Immigrants"

looks like YOU don't know the difference - or don't care

WITH the recent publication of the Rand Corporations long-awaited report Immigration in a Changing Economy: Californias Experience, a significant paradigm shift in economists thinking about immigration is complete. Traditionally, economists have taken a (mildly) benign view of immigration. But the new consensus is that this does not apply to the particular influx accidentally unleashed by the 1965 Immigration Act. The reasons: the paradoxes of the current selection system, which has produced an uncontrolled, largely unskilled, non-English-speaking flow; and the perverse incentives of massive transfer programs for health, education, and welfare. The solution, according to Rand: reducing immigration to "a moderate range around the 550,000 a year envisioned by the Jordan Commission in 1995 and embodied in the ill-fated 1996 Smith - Simpson bill. Instead, the influx is likely to be double or triple that range as far as the eye can see.

The Rand study comes four months after the equally devastating National Academy of Sciences report (see NR, "The Week, June 16). The NAS found that the infinitesimal macroeconomic benefits to Americans of the current immigration presence estimated at $1 to $10 billion in a $7.5-trillion economy were being swamped by a net fiscal cost estimated at $15 to $20 billion. In California, this net fiscal burden amounted to an astounding $1,174 tax for every native household. America had a revolution over less.

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1282/is_n19_v49/ai_19866325

The racism by some of the anti-immigrant people is amazing.

[QOUTE]
The best thing you clowns could do would be to ignore them and not even show up.
[END QUOTE]

If we ignore them we will be guilty of not learning from the past history of Race Supremacists tactics.

The monument has nothing to do with Illegal Immigration - and everyone knows it.

You see, it's a power play - they want to prove that a handful of racists can impose their will on thousands of Hispanics, simply because they consider themselves the Master Race.

We greatly appreciate all of the support we’ve received from our non-Hispanic friends. Without them we would probably suffer more hostilities and violence.

You are right about their wanting to incite a riot by getting us all stirred up with anger – you can tell that by the language they use in their posts: Vermin, Infiriorboy, Pancho, Cesspool, monkey humping donkeys, etc…

At the demonstrations they play the innocent mild manner good neighbor, but in here you can plainly see them for what they really are.

[QUOTE]Everything in America was great, before illegal Mexicans started invading our country.[END QUOTE]

According to Baca, the statement "It was better before they came." was uttered by a white politician talking about Mexicans.

You just said the same thing.

I think you would want a monument that enforces your beliefs to remain standing (which it will, in spite of your scornful opinion).

I think you really want it down because you don't want to admit that you made a mistake and misread, misinterpreted and misunderstood the inscription you attacked.

The statement “This land was Mexican once” is true; “was Indian always” is also true; as for the inscription “and is and will be [Indian] again” is nothing more than a guess and not seditious at all.

Just admit that you blew it. Go home, read a book, chill out and enjoy life in peace.

I know SOS people are here, and this is written to them. Good pictures on your website today. You guys (and ladies) have been to enough events since Baldwin Park, it is time to sit down with all your pictures and evaluate some stuff. First, look at the people against you. Each protest is growing in size, but in each protest, you will find almost a completely different group of people. This is because on of the major problems in the progressive community is that a lot of people are not willing to travel far. That means that each community you enter now knows about you, and is ready to show opposition to you. This also demonstrates how many people in California oppose your group, your goals, and your tactics. Your side, on the other hand, is the same 30 idiots who have to drive all over the place to make a stand. You are getting news, but your membership in Southern California is not growing. You have to sit back and think about this, you need to figure out what your critical breaking point is, and decide how far you are willing to go. The fact is, opposition against you will continue to grow. More and more people will come to the ranks against your violence and racism (yes, I consider the harassment and attempted denial of the ability to earn and eat, as a violent act against undocumented workers). When you go back to BP, you are walking into a hornet’s nest, and the stings are going to hurt (metaphor, NOT a threat, though I think that your stupidity is at the level that IF someone DOES get hurt, it is your own damn fault!). After BP, opposition will grow even more. The KKK is able to withstand the masses because they make very few appearances, and have the money to buy their safety (bullet proof windows, vests, get away cars, and lots of security), but they have a national membership base that can support that, and hundreds of years of history, your group lacks both. Your group will not last the way it is, cities are already passing laws to suppress the people, BECAUSE of you. Many cities are already investigating lawsuits against SOS and Joe to compensate them for the financial burden of your stupidity (in many cities, the KKK reimburses the city for police hours). Seasoned organizers who oppose you will not be able to continue to control and restrain everyone as the numbers grow. The opposition is already at a size where no one is saying they can guarantee your safety. Are you going to do this until someone gets killed, or are you going to wake up, and re-evaluate your methods sooner?

This is a message of concern. When I was first reading the posts on your site (after BP1), there was someone who seemed like s/he was trying to give you a heads up on the situation you were creating, and the shit storm that was looming. Well, that shit storm is now right around the corner. You may want to re-evaluate your position, or at the least, your residence in California. The people of this great state have already spoken, and since this IS a democracy, just leave. We don't want your kind here, and we are happy with allowing undocumented workers in. We accept them as part of our community. If you continue to stay and try to strong arm people, renounce democracy and America. This is a land where the majority gets to decide policy, and we are the majority. Get out! Tell you what, I would hate to be Joe, he is going to have a lifetime of guilt after he gets some hurt, or god forbidden, killed.

All you creeps are doing is causing more and more Americans to hate illegal aliens!
Do you realize that Americans don't like our American citizens
or our Flag being attacked by illegal foreigners?
JULY 4th is coming up! Make our DAY!

Keep attacking SOS!
You are making yourselves look like A**Holes!

Hahahahahahahaha

I do not seek a dialog with you racists, but if you are correct, why isn't this increased support evident in your numbers. It is the same racist assholes that came out a couple months ago. And BTW, a few thousand emails of support from people in groups like Stromfront, National Alliance, KKK, American Nazi Party, and groups like that does not equate to "American Support". I just don't see anyone coming to your aid. The opposition, on the other hand, is growing exponentially. Your rants stay the same, but if you want us to really believe your rhetoric, you will need to bring more people than a couple of ex-marines, and a group of AZ Minutemen to prove it. You get three or four thousand people to go to Baldwin Park, and I may retract my statement. As it appears, the people of America are OVERWHELMINGLY against you.

We went to Vege, and it was awesome. Yes, Happy Family is very good, but I think Vege is just as good. The fake fish was really good today.

1Planet - I don't know if there's any value in telling them what you just said. They've heard the stuff from me a long time ago. They've heard the arguments on their own forums, but, they don't listen. Oh well.

Today, though, I was heartened to talk to someone mainstream who has a real handle on the issue. The problem is centered around the law. It doesn't have a provision to allow people who really want to immigrate, to immigrate.

If there's any "immigration reform" due, it's to create more opportunities for immigration. The current laws aren't workable, and they don't try to work with reality.

That is the problem. The reason for legal immigration is protection against criminals and health concerns. The problem comes down to when people are not allowed to immigrate. The only restrictions should be based on health and safety, but these racists want to "regulate" the populations so the white majority can remain the white majority. My family came over with the Homestead Act, when our nation was driving back Native Americans and replacing them with Europeans. When we took Altza, we drove the Mexicans and Native Americans south of the Rio, and replaced them with more white people. Many of us understand this, and we understand that a Mexican and an American are equals, and we should have the same equal opportunity to make a life. These racists don't want equality or freedom; they want White/American privilege. The also probably shop at Old Navy and/or Wal Mart, and love the products of cheap labor that causes the problems that makes these people need to come here. If we close the border, and do not let these people come here, we ensure the slavery of the third world nations for the profits of the first world nations. Of course, this response isn't for you as much as it is for them, but when we don't allow for them to come here documented, then I will fight for their ability to come here undocumented.

Also, the MMP is saying that they want everyone to bring baseball bats to the border. I wander what this means, and what it will be used for....

Sounds like a declaration of war to me....

Most of us are not interested in staring at your face every time you post here. Now that we've seen what you look like - a suburban Sony Bono imitator from 1976 - why do we have to keep seeing you again? As for judging a book by its cover - in your case I think the cover and its contents are both vacant and uninteresting. It is like a cheap paperback thriller - don't try to convince yourself that the contents are going to be any better than the sappy cover.

I understand that you are pro-illegal aliens, but you must realize that even Mexico is opposed to illegal immigration, do a search on how Salvadorians are treated while traveling illegally through Mexico.

We simply cannot afford to continue the flood coming into this country, that is the problem. They simply have to use legal means to enter our country.

I'm in favor of immigration, but I am opposed to illegal immigration.

If you are fortunate enough to gain entry, even illegally(which, again, I oppose) then at least love this country, do not spew venom and hatred, or bite the hand that feeds you.

...if the system don't work, you don't target the people caught up in it...

...you fix the system.

What is it, exactly, that SOS or MM are doing to address the shortcoming of the broken system?

Lets see....um, shaming the bush admin, bringing national attention to the broken border and keeping there. Shoud we keep going ?

Soooo, what are we doing zactly ?

...how does protesting an obscure monument in BP shame da shrub administration?

...besides, da shrub obviously HAS no shame, so I can't think of a more pointless goal.

If you claim to have brought national attention to the issue, what do you plan to do with it?

Are you lobbying any governent officials involved in immigration policy?

Have you suggested any specifics on what policy fixes you would encourage to help reduce undocumented immigrant entry?

Have you teamed with potential immigrants on the opposite side of the border to hold teach-in on how to enter the country legally?

Just what I thought....no answers, 'cause you are not REALLY concerned with immigration...illegal or otherwise.

...and you wonder why people consider you racists....

Everyone is missing one point. What is good for the people of Mexico? The best thing for Mexico is to stop giving Mexican citizens work in the U.S., and give them a job in Mexico. It probably is true that we can use some number of Mexican citezens as temporary workers, but lets have a plan to allow it. Lets also help to create jobs in Mexico (or is it a lost cause?) Why don't we focus on the real problem; the Mexican government. Mexico has natural resorces and intelegent people to become equal with the U.S.Let's make it happen. We don't have a problem with Canadians coming over to the U.S. because the like Canada beter. What's wrong with Mexico? I enjoy visiting Mexico. My father lives there, and he's American. Why must we fight over this silly thing, when we all want the same thing. Only a few crazy people on both sides of the issue don't want what's reasonable. Lets get together and figure out how we can create jobs in Mexico. I would love to have Mexicans build product for me. Lets make Mexico a rich land. How can I help?