As I sat on a bus today, inching along in traffic, it became clear to me that all buses should be free. People who ride buses are providing a public service. To charge money to ride the bus is insane. Bus riders are REDUCING TRAFFIC CONGESTION for the one person per car overload on our streets and freeways. Bus riders ARE REDUCING POLLUTION. Bus riders are using considerably LESS GAS, and many buses are run on electricity, not Middle Eastern oil. According to statistics, 3% of the population rides buses. A way to increase the number would be to make buses FREE.

I propose a tax be added to auto licensing fees, car sales taxes, etc. to subsidize the bus systems. If cars insist on clogging the roads to a point where the traffic is impenetrable, the sky is hazy, and the gas is priced sky-high, then they need to be willing to PAY anyone willing to ride a bus. So they can continue to clog streets and guzzle gas, sitting in their cars alone. It is time to make the people driving cars, pay outright, for the traffic-reducing, pollution-reducing, gas-conserving buses, not the bus riders.

total agreement from me.

Why not make bicycles free, and eliminate buses? Or pay people to ride them? Why not charge a tax equal to the price of the car every year, or every month? Why not pass a law to make everyone a vegan?

Idiot commie bitch.

Buses and other forms of mass transit should be free, and they would be free in a civilized society. Cars should be outlawed as a menace to society; eliminating them would save the lives of tens of thousands of people each year who are killed in accidents or run over by drunken drivers. And think of the reduction of cancer cases due to atmospheric pollution and the reduction of debt that the average family goes into largely to support a filth-emitting box of steel and glass resting on tires. In addition, urban sprawl and continued suburbanization would come to a halt without the automobile. And teenagers would not be killed or have their legs blown off in Iraq protecting the oil supply of Exxon and other corporations that make obscene profits by selling that poison to fools like you.

Residential and industrial areas are planed to be so far apart?

Because this necessitates the commute and insures the consumption of fuel.

We need solar powered rail lines...

And city planners that aren't in the hands of corporate control.

Perhaps you'd prefer the whole country getting around on identical skinny black bikes, like they do in, say, Communist China? Maybe no one should be able to go more than 5 miles from the village they were born in. It would sure cut down on pollution.

And "no blood for oil" is sure an original one. I'm sure the rets of the sophomore class at your high school is real proud.

As was said before, idiot commie jackass, grow up.

How about night commuting?

Since most of the traffic occurs durring the day, this would cut down on major fuel consumption. This is something that should have been developed 20 years ago.

Sorry to have to break the news that evidently hasn't penetrated to your remote village yet, but the choices for travel over distances longer than five miles are not limited to automobiles and bicycles. If you re-read the original posting of this thread, you will see that it dealt with buses. Ever hear of them? Or do you think of them as exotic things that white people never use? There are also such things as (wait till you read this!) trolleys and subways. You can get around Boston, Toronto, even much of the Bay Area far faster, cheaper and more conveniently using them than you can in an automobile - and you don't have to worry about someone stealing or stripping the subway train while you are shopping. Lastly, it might do you some good to go out and do some walking instead instead of watching re-runs of Friends on the idiot box. Not only will you get some exercise, but you might even see some poor people.

What an incredibly ridiculous idea. That somehow, buss riders are doing those with cars a "favor" is just plain nonsense. And that we who have cars should pay for them is even more ridiculous. The whole implication of this is that those with cars are somehow greedy and selfish and have lauded oppression over the poor noble buss riders. And now we should pay these gentle folk back. Bullshit.

First of all taxes allready go towards the metro system. Enough taxes. Secondly, the entire notion that I should have to pay for someone elses life choices or situation is abhorrent. Suppose someone is on the bus because they lost their license drunk driving. Why should anyone have to pay for that?

Just another example of shortsighted leftist socialism. Let non one be responsible for their own actions and, whenever possible, punish those who have succeeded.

Fortunately for us all, your utopian ideal of everyone riding around the unspoiled countryside with a baguette in a basket is just that, your fantasy. Like it or not, (and I know you hate it) America thrives because people can get where they need to, when they need to, in cars. Could you shop for a family of six, or a small business, on your trusty 3 speed? Or even a solar powered train? Yeah, I've ridden subways around the world, and some work just fine, but they work because everything in , for example, Manhattan, is just a couple blocks from everything else. Care to try that in LA? Oh, wait, I take that back, you would, wouldn't you?

Lefty fool, tear yourself away from All Socialist Things Considered on your solar powered radio and realize how the world works. Maybe you'll get your shot in the Age of Aquarius, but not before.

Even after securing all the oil in Iraaq, Saudi Arabia and the rest of the world, we will run out of it or find that the cost is prohibitive to use...

Forget global warming ( I know you will) remember only the excuses will also run out. As will the time of grace needed to provide other methods of energy.

That we should reduce our dependency on oil and reduce emmissions is not arguable. I agree with you.

That I should be taxed even more to pay for the bus rides of others is inane. As if they are performing some sort of noble public service.

Stop using this anti-oil paltform to try and push through some new unrelated, socialist, anti-personal responsibility, higher taxes bullshit.

"Suppose someone is on the bus because they lost their license drunk driving. Why should anyone have to pay for that?"

suppose a wealthy person in bel air buys a hummer h-2 (that will only see asphalt throughout its life, never going off-road) and manages to get a tens-of-thousands of dollars "farm vehicle" subsidy back from the federal government? why should anyone have to pay for that?

Cars are here to stay. I'm not interested in riding anywhere on a crowded bus or train. I'd perfer to drive. So that's what I'm going to do. You wanna ride the bus, go right ahead. Just don't ask to do it on my quarter.

BTW, reports are out. Sept. 20003 sales for autos were up 13% over Sept, 2002. Top selling models: Light trucks, Vans, and (drum roll please) SUV's.

Me me me me me me. I want I want I want I want I want. I don't care about tens of thousands of people killed in car accidents, tons of carcinogens released into the air, and people being shot, dismembered or burned to death in Iraq to insure that I have gas for my car. I am the only one who counts. Just ask my mommy; she said I could have all the toys I want because I have a right to them - I am a suburban American.

And by the way, the Middle East countries have some kind of legal or moral obligation to provide the US with gas that is cheap enough so that it can build its "transportation system" around the private automobile. It must be written out in the UN Charter, the Bible, the Book of Mormon or something like that. Go USA!

"Me me me me me me. I want I want I want I want I want......"

Your childish temper tantrums don't mean anything to me. I'll drive my car, I burn whatever octane gas I want to, and if you don't like it, that's your problem.

I drive a GMC Yukon and my wife drives a Ford Expedition. If I see you, I'll wave. Maybe.

No, I'm afraid that it is going to be your problem now that the have-nots of this world have decided that you don't have any God-given right to walk on them. The world is going to run out of petroleum, but you are going to be cut off from cheap gas long before that.

Hate cars all you want; they will continue to exist.

Not everything is convenient to public transportation. Not every activity is readily amenable to public transportation. Can't get groceries for 6 or sheets of plywood on the bus.

By the time petroleum becomes too expensive to use, alternatively-fueled vehicles will be widespread. We Americans are too used to our freedom, our independence, to do without personal transporttion.

The Middle East is under no obligation to provide anyone with oil. That falls under the category "free enterprise", which is, of course, against your politics.

Furthermore, for the most part, no one should be forced to pay for services they don't use. By your logic, obese people should pay for healthy people's aerobics classes. Non-smokers should pay for smoker's lung cancer surgery.

Or does that appeal to your socialist nature, too?

The market will take care of things when gas gets to be too expensive. That's the beauty of free-market capitalism. Just like the car took the place of the horse and wagon, something else will come along.

Yeah, it came along once before - it was called the Great Depression of the 1930's.

Especially the way it manifests itself in huge insurance payments, repair expenditures, and ever-rising gasoline prices. What, me worry? I love going 14 miles per hour, the projected speed on LA freeways in a few years. Carjackings? Coming out of a store and finding your car stolen? Drunken, wrong-way drivers on a freeway at night? What a joke! Ha Ha.

And I certainly need a car to buy lumber and similar items. I bet no one bought lumber in the days before there were cars. There were no such things as delivery vehicles. Besides, I am one of those guys you hear about on the KNX or KFWB traffic reports - "some jerk lost a load of lumber off his car and traffic is really backed up." Besides, cars must be wonderful - I heard that they are on Fox News.

"Yeah, it came along once before - it was called the Great Depression of the 1930's."

With such optimistic members, I can see why the Angry Left is such a growing movement.

""Suppose someone is on the bus because they lost their license drunk driving. Why should anyone have to pay for that?"

suppose a wealthy person in bel air buys a hummer h-2 (that will only see asphalt throughout its life, never going off-road) and manages to get a tens-of-thousands of dollars "farm vehicle" subsidy back from the federal government? why should anyone have to pay for that?

"

They shouldn't. But the solution should not be even more insane taxation.

yes there is much 'insane taxation' such as the bill for this Israeli

occupation, the occupation in Korea, the bogus 'war on drugs, the

bailout of the looting of the S & L, the toys weapon contractors sell the

pentagon, the new Dept. of Homeland Security, subsidies that are given to Agriculture and myriad other

excuses to bleed the tax payer while the programs that are meant for the welfare of the people are starved in oder to pay for them.

You just want socialism for the well to do.

This drum beat about 'taxation' is a two faced whine that is nothing short of hypocrisy.

Then may cause you great anxiety, but we don't care. We don't listen to citizens such as yourself who complains about where the tax money goes since you don't contribute enough in to have a say. Whenever you start earning 0K+/yr and stop mooching off food stamps, free health care clinics, and public housing, depending on your politics we may listen.

you are not the american people.

You're just another useless parasite whining about having to contribute.

I work and pay taxes. Do you? Or are you sucking at the teat of socialism for the rich?

Tht's not enough. You've got to contribute more than just your measley little income. Like I said, are you earning over 0K/yr? If not, you're not worth consideration. Also, if your politics are left-of-center, it doesn't matter how much you make, you're not worth consideration.

I'm self-employed. I probably make more a month than you make in five years. I live by the Golden Rule. He who has the gold, rules. It was in play long before any of us were born. Just some of us can play the game better than others.

thank you for the ' insight' into the mind of the parisite class.

Doing well there, very telling.

Yeah, I'm not very bright, all the way to the bank.

Cha-Ching!!!!!!!!!

Actually, you're the parasite class. Since I pay in more than you, that means I've contributed more towards the infrastructure that we share equally, i.e. roads, schools. So, because I make up for the lack of what you put in, you're living on your quarter plus some of mine. But you know your place in society and you stay there, and that's all I ask.

Public transit needs to be free to promote it's use.

There are so many "invisible" subsidies for roads, gasoline and automakers and polluting cars that driving becomes less costly as a result of this cost shifing to the taxbase as a whole.

The savings to the taxpayer from less environmental damage, less congestion, more pedestrians shopping, and many other benefits too many to name argue for this proposition.

And by way of further thought-since we pay folks not to raise food why not pay folks not to drive?

Most people have to be a certain place at a certain time. So buses are not much good for them. And if illegal aliens get driver's licenses, they won't be any good for them, either.

To all:

First of all, I ride the bus pretty damn close to every day of my life. I feel that my part is done with road space conservation and minimizing pollution...however that doesn't mean that I'm about to boycott cars! Give your heads a shake people. Especially you Car Hater and "I love cars". Cars are not going to be the birth of the apocolypse. On the other hand they certainly aren't the most friendly invention to planet Earth, but there is worse. Given, cars cause extensive damage to the environment, along with many other issues...but I'm confident that this will soon be a thing of the past. Hydrogen cars are well on their way (Now available on many markets) and as you know, the emmisions are water. (Let's just hope that Hydrogen will be a reliable resource) Anyway, back to the point;

Instead of making the auto drivers pay for our travelling costs because WE CHOOSE to use public transit, point the finger at the party who's upping transit fairs. Take action for your cause. Get involved with your community/government....etc.

As for you "I love cars", Grow the f*ck up. It's pretentious pricks that form the narrow minded, elite stereotype of an American. Sure, nobody can stop you from bootin' around in your Yukon, but check your f*ckin' attitude man. Try focusing on the issue and leave your elite disposition at the door.