|
printable version
- js reader version
- view hidden posts
- tags and related articles
View article without comments
by Scott Alan Woodard
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 4:58 PM
Why does the call for peace stir up such hatred?
I am against the military action that the U.S. and Britain are taking in Iraq.
I am against this current U.S. administration that seeks to shred our Bill of Rights and wantonly attack and conquer for it’s own secret agenda.
I am a proud American.
Prior to the current crisis, my “involvement” in politics was rather subdued. I would watch and read and listen to the news, and while I often found myself enlightened and occasionally outraged about certain things, I never took to the streets and I never felt as passionate about something as I do now.
When the bombs started falling on Baghdad and the innocent began to feel fear and die, things changed. Something inside snapped. It was time to write letters, make telephone calls and get out on the streets and voice my disgust.
Thankfully, we live in a country that encourages opinion, even dissenting opinion, don’t we? I thought we did… Doesn’t that glorious first amendment in the Bill Of Rights of that grand document known as The Constitution of The United States read: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances”?
And yet, as I have been gathering with anywhere from a handful of people to crowds in excess of ten or twenty-thousand, I find souls on my side of the yellow tape wanting nothing more than a better world for all, while on the other side (beyond the 200-plus-strong line of well-equipped police officers) pass examples of hatred and evil beyond imagining.
Let me explain. We hold signs and call for justice. We shout things like “Stop the killing,” “Bring our troops home now,” and “Peace,” while at the same time savage insults and verbal attacks are spewed at us from passing vehicles. Just yesterday, as I stood with a small group of people on a local corner, I witnessed words and gestures of unbridled hatred. As small children stood with their parents, proudly expressing themselves, venomous attacks were hurled at us.
What is it about a desire for peace that stirs these people into frenzy? The actions of these folks make me ashamed to be a proud American and that is not right at all.
Ultimately, what drives people to shout, “I wish you had all been in the Towers” (no joke about that one), is simple “brainwashing.” A large number of people in this country are lazy. It is a lot easier to flip on Fox News and count that as your single source of information than it is to watch three or four or six news channels and listen to a few radio stations and visit dozens of websites and read a number of magazines and newspapers. It is easier to go along with what is said during Bush’s speeches or the Pentagon briefings than it is to research, question and make up your own mind. The problem with that, though, is laziness (and submission) allows those in power to take advantage of us all and that can lead to destruction.
People cheer for the troops, but they fail to acknowledge the meat-grinder-like shredding of an innocent victim of a cluster bomb. They listen to our president proclaim that this is all about liberating a repressed population under the thumb of a vicious dictator, but they fail to realize that the U.S. has had numerous dealings with this dictator, and said dictator has been in power since 1968 (as vice-president and president since 1979). They believe that the people of Iraq are going to shower our troops with flowers and candy, but they fail to see that Iraqi families are taking up arms to defend their homes against the “invaders.”
Thank goodness for all of us who acknowledge that something is truly rotten in Washington. Since the president is a public servant, we must always remember that he works for us. He doesn’t rule us with an iron fist and he is not and never should be, above criticism. Theodore Roosevelt (a Republican president, by the way) said:
"The President is merely the most important among a large number of public servants. He should be supported or opposed exactly to the degree which is warranted by his good conduct or bad conduct, his efficiency or inefficiency in rendering loyal, able, and disinterested service to the nation as a whole. Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his acts, and this means that it is exactly as necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else."
There is much said in this quote that should be understood and embraced by people regardless of which side of the issue they stand on.
Let us speak out (without fear of foul language, squealing tires and tossed soda and beer cans) and maybe… just maybe, you might learn something from us.
Report this post as:
by thompson
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 5:05 PM
i think the president is doing two things: protecting us and giving iraqis something they have never tasted, freedom from tyranny. the wolfowitz ideology is pretty scarry but first and foremost the president will not allow another 9-11.
i disagree with your comment that the bill of rights is being shredded. you are allowed to protest. i think that most people who really can't stand people who protest is because most strategies break the law. and that's something that is highly unamerican.
Report this post as:
by Scott Alan Woodard
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 6:15 PM
My comment about the current administration "shredding" the Bill Of Rights is not solely directed at our first amendment right, and our right to protest... I am talking about all of the other frightening things that are on the administration's agenda... Everything from The Patriot Act to Tips, etc.
And all those who label US (meaning those who speak out against the invasion of Iraq or Bush or his policies) "terrorists" are publically rallying in favor of the "shredding" of said rights.
What kind of American is it that throws a full cup of soda out of a moving car at a 10 year-old girl holding a "Kids For Peace" sign (this also has happened (and probably on more than one occasion))? The kind that is blindly being led along a dark path by the current administration.
Question authority, don't kowtow to it.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 7:12 PM
this is getting old. Where're you from?
Just blow in?
You're funny. We took away the freedom from them
when we took out their democracy and put Saddam in.
The meatpuppet in the offal office is kicking a hornet's nest of hatred in this world.
Stop blowing chunks here.
Report this post as:
by fresca
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 7:17 PM
"We took away the freedom from them
when we took out their democracy and put Saddam in."
More sheepdog parallel universe history I suppose. Now he has it that WE put Sadam in power in the first place.
LOL.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 7:26 PM
Hi, fresca.
Well, are you spayed yet?
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog again, fresca.
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 7:36 PM
You are one mean, stupid individual. Bush Admirer with
part of the burner cloged.
I'll just address you as it. But I hope you are nuter, like
a stupid/hate vending machine.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 8:04 PM
I'll toss you a link.
"-And leaders have indeed been killed, with CIA connivance. During the 1950s, 60s and 70s the agency clandestinely and successfully masterminded coups in Iran, Guatemala, Iraq, Chile, Guyana and the Congo, formerly Zaire.-"
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=15&ItemID=1579
Report this post as:
by fresca
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 8:32 PM
"And leaders have indeed been killed, with CIA connivance. During the 1950s, 60s and 70s the agency clandestinely and successfully masterminded coups in Iran, Guatemala, Iraq, Chile, Guyana and the Congo, formerly Zaire. "
Above is all of the text from the ENTIRE article which you posted which even remotely mentions Iraq. Now I can see that someone has gone to the trouble of typing these two sentences into a HTML page and then posted it. But if this is all the proof you need on a subject to form a worldview, then I guess all I can say is, I'm sorry for you.
I'll need JUST A BIT more proof than those two sentences, as compelling as they are, in order to understand how it is that WE put Sadam in power in the first place.
Let's just, for your sake, forget you even posted that link. Try again.
Report this post as:
by Roger Jones
Sunday, Apr. 06, 2003 at 9:36 PM
Scott:
Thank you for putting into words precisely what I have felt since the bombs started to fall. Never have I understood, as I do now, what courage and defiance it takes to stand up for the basic human and constitutional rights that I thought were guaranteed to us, but for which we must now fight to maintain.
The evil and greed unleashed against the world by this administration is incomprehensible. My entire world has had to change. I learn more every day about the war crimes of George Jr. and Sr. I was ignorant; I had never heard of the "highway of death." I did not know about the human rights violations in the former Yugoslavia or in Afghanistan. I am sick of the lies and the duplicity.
Where do we go from here? How do we stop the campaign of hatred and atrocities from spreading? How do we ensure UN involvement in the rebuilding of Iraq? How do we get rid of George W.? Please tell me that you have some hope.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 12:46 AM
Iraq, on the other hand, was a pro-Western country until 1958, when its British-installed
monarchy was overthrown. Fearing that Iraq might turn communist under the new military regime,
the United States dabbled in a temporary alliance of convenience with the Baíath (Renaissance)
Party in its efforts to grab power. CIA agents provided critical logistical information to the coup
plotters and supplied lists with the names of hundreds of suspected Communists to be eliminated.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/commandingheights/lo/countries/iq/iq_overview.html
Report this post as:
by against good and peace
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 12:59 AM
I agree with the point about all the hate against the protesters. Some people are kind and good and right. Some people are stupid, ignorant and brutal. The always tend to be working class, blue collar types, football fans and tabloid reading. Some end up in the military, the police or the bouncer trade. They are natures barbarians and they know it. With little intellect , they hate a world they cannot understand. It is not their fault. They are the left side of the Bell curve.
Report this post as:
by soup ignorant
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 1:22 AM
I found out about a little pro-war demonstration last night and decided my friend and I should make an appearance. While there for an hour, we were booed, threatened and even had half a dozen eggs thrown at us (thankfully none hitting us). This is no way to act, especially when they're claiming to be true patriots but are treating their fellow brothers and sisters like this that are are in belief that they are doing what is best for the country. I mean...I thought that was what true patriotism is about...Doing what's best for your country. Not blindly hating and following.
Report this post as:
by smelly
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 2:14 AM
My first time to this site and there is no wonder that the world is in the shape its in, YOu people are a bunch if whinning a-holes, with nothing better to do than trade your witty comments. Less of this sort of thing would go a long way in making the world a better place. Saddam has to go...Dead Preferably! I would be willing to bet that most of you weren't even born when Rumsfeld (donald) went as an American ambassador to welcome Saddam into power in Iraq. Now, he wants his ass. If you hang around long enough, you will always see things come full circle.
So, protest, that is our right, but keep your mouth shut while our troops are deployed. They need our support.
Just my stinkin' 2 cents worth!
Report this post as:
by Grandma
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 5:00 AM
an_aging_hippie_pin.gif, image/png, 100x99
I have been involved in politics since the late 1950's. I have probably forgotten more than you know. Well, that seems pretty obvious by the tone of your post. Learn a little before you shoot off your mouth. K?
Report this post as:
by fresca
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 5:29 AM
"Iraq, on the other hand, was a pro-Western country until 1958, when its British-installed
monarchy was overthrown. Fearing that Iraq might turn communist under the new military regime,
the United States dabbled in a temporary alliance of convenience with the Baíath (Renaissance)
Party in its efforts to grab power. CIA agents provided critical logistical information to the coup
plotters and supplied lists with the names of hundreds of suspected Communists to be eliminated.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/commandingheights/lo/countries/iq/iq_overview.html"
Thanks again for yet another link which has not two but zero sentences referencing your "theory". Keep up the keen research.
Report this post as:
by daveman
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 7:49 AM
"Never have I understood, as I do now, what courage and defiance it takes to stand up for the basic human and constitutional rights that I thought were guaranteed to us, but for which we must now fight to maintain. "
And that is what we are trying to bring to the Iraqis. Who are we to say that they don't deserve the same rights and liberties that we enjoy?
Regardless of what you think is the reason for the war ...the Iraqis will be liberated. You can all spout Imperialism and Oil and whatever the reason du jour is, but they will be freed to enjoy the rights of free speech, press, and peacable assembly.
You know, the rights they haven't had for the last 25 years, while they were being gassed, starved, and tortured.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 8:02 AM
From: "tim buckley" tim.buckley@DELETETHIStesco.net>
Subject: How the CIA put the Baath in power
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 10:52:24 -0800
-...What tipped the balance against him was the involvement of the United States. He had
taken Iraq out of the anti-Soviet Baghdad Pact. In 1961, he threat-
ened to occupy Kuwait and nationalized part of the Iraq Petroleum
Company (IPC), the foreign oil consortium that exploited Iraq's oil.
In retrospect, it was the ClAs favorite coup. "We really had the ts
crossed on what was happening," James Critchfield, then head of the
CIA in the Middle East, told us. "We regarded it as a great victory."
Iraqi participants later confirmed American involvement. "We came to
power on a CIA train," admitted Ali Saleh Sa'adi, the Baath Party sec-
retary general who was about to institute an unprecedented reign of
terror. CIA assistance reportedly included coordination of the coup
plotters from the agency's station inside the U.S. embassy in Baghdad
as well as a clandestine radio station in Kuwait and solicitation of
advice from around the Middle East on who on the left should be
eliminated once the coup was successful...-
http://www.casi.org.uk/discuss/2000/msg01267.html
Gerard Chaliand and Ismet Seriff Vanly, People Without A Country, 1980, 184.
Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventions since World War II
(Monroe, Maine: Common Courage Press, 1995)
Report this post as:
by daveman
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 8:52 AM
So what?
Did I do it? Did you do it? Did the current administration do it? Did the last administration do anything about it?
NO.
Did it ever occur to you that this is a chance to make it right?
Or is it that once someone makes a mistake, that mistake can never be forgiven, and him, his children, and whatever groups he was affiliated with are forever responsible?
Well, then.
Are you a white male? Then you are responsible for:
--Slavery of Africans.
--The Holocaust.
--The use of nuclear weapons on the Japanese mainland.
--The slaughter and removal from their ancestral homes of indigenous North Americans.
--The near extinction of humpback whales.
-- Any of a thousand other atrocities committed by white males.
My point is, history is in the past, the past is immutable, and you should just Get. Over. It. Stop holding people accountable for actions they did not commit.
If you insist on making statements like, "We put him there!", carry on to the logical conclusion. If you don't like where the path leads, don't take the first step.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 1:15 PM
Get over it.
That’s what the fascist right keeps saying as they leave a trail of blood and
terror across the world. And then people like you can’t understand why this is a big problem.
Follow me on this slowly.
The CIA is an Agency under the control to whom ever can hire it's services. That’s why it’s an Agency, not a Department.
To paraphrase an interview on C-Span with the director, Wolsey, I believe
he was asked if the U.S. offshore corporations cooperated with the interests of the Central Intelligence Agency and his reply was, and this is a direct quote, “...no, it’s the other way around...”
So I was presumed to believe he meant it and the CIA is the attack dog of
U.S. foreign economic interests.
This is quite a distance from its original task of intelligence gathering.
Get over it.
I don’t think so.
This is my tax money being used to enrich a few super wealthy families
with a price tag of hatred and horror they never pay.
We pay. with our loss of blood and liberty as this creation of evil leads us
into war and darkness. Yeah, I’ve got issues with the CIA.
Get over it.
Report this post as:
by daveman
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 1:29 PM
...we need to demonstrate!
Yeah! A big march with signs like "No Blood for CIA" and "CIA = Hitler"!
Oooh! And one that says "No Central Intelligence In Our Name"!
That would be appropriate...
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 1:37 PM
You merely reveal your banal arrogance and inhuman detachment from this very real rampage of pain and grief.
You are unable to feel it. You are not a human.
I am not a member of your sick value system.
You are the enemy.
Get over it.
Report this post as:
by daveman
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 2:05 PM
I am in no way detached from the suffering going on. As a member of the military, I have perhaps a little better handle on it than you do.
Please post a link to the CIA director C-SPAN interview, please. Then we'll talk.
I swore to God to protect, with my life, the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic. Inclusive in that is your right to hate this country and her leaders. I have no problem with that. You may even call me your enemy. Big deal. Issue a fatwah, already. You are allowed.
To the Indymedia crowd in general: you can't hurt me. You can't hurt my feelings. You can't change my mind. Do you know why? Your arguments are irrelevant; your position is untenable; your philosophy is discredited and therefore irelevant. History is unfolding, and the only mark you will leave on it is that you barfed and crapped in the street. How do you expect to be taken seriously when you do idiotic stuff like that? And you actually believe it will make a difference? You must have an exceptionally low opinion of your fellow citizens. All you succed in doing is pissing off a lot of people, especially the ones who have to clean up your shit and puke. I'm betting none of you brought pooper-scoopers to clean up after yourselves.
Here's a hint. Make your point using facts, not excreta. People will actually listen instead of turning away in disgust. A good 75% of the posts I read on Indymedia are ridiculous moral equivalencies and 8-year-old fascination with foul language. This isn't second grade, people; this is real life. "Dude, you suck!" will not win you any converts, nor will it convince your opponents.
Report this post as:
by wow
Monday, Apr. 07, 2003 at 2:12 PM
Report this post as:
by Scottie
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 2:53 AM
Nice posts mate..
I see Im not needed in this thread.
Report this post as:
by Get a Life Daveman
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 2:59 AM
shitty_post.gif, image/gif, 590x673
Your posts are truly stupid. Please consider not wasting everyone's time. Thanks.
Report this post as:
by Eric
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 9:37 AM
5th column leftist liberalist anarchist radical socialist anti-globalist pieces of camel dung. Every last one of 'em.
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 9:56 AM
That's what you always say:
After getting the snot slapped out of all of you.
You always slime back in for your laughable posts for
yet another day of desperate spin control (attempts)
we watch the telegraphic as the enemy tries to adapt.
Report this post as:
by MM
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 10:38 AM
aislin.jpg, image/jpeg, 360x360
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 11:19 AM
And spam.
Attempts to justify, trivialize and side track.
Weapons of death and terror unleashed again upon the
innocents of the world to steal the treasure coveted
by greedy sick and evil individuals standing on an ever widening gulf of isolation from humanity.
You have thrown away any pretense.
Get over it.
Report this post as:
by Funny Stuff
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 12:06 PM
clement.gif, image/png, 504x447
Report this post as:
by Sheepdog
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 12:15 PM
When they have power, I'm sure they are all sitting
comfortably in their living rooms, watching TV.
Enjoying the spring breezes, having Bar B Ques.
Maybe taking in a camel race or two.
Ever been to a burn ward? One filled with the results
of incendiaries and low on supplies while over flowing
with casualties? With failing or cut power?
Nice work.
Report this post as:
by Funny Stuff
Wednesday, Apr. 09, 2003 at 12:17 PM
duffy.gif, image/png, 450x328
Report this post as:
|