We had a server outage, and we're rebuilding the site. Most of the site features won't work. Thank you for your patience.
imc indymedia

Los Angeles Indymedia : Activist News

white themeblack themered themetheme help
About Us Contact Us Calendar Publish RSS
latest news
best of news




A-Infos Radio

Indymedia On Air

Dope-X-Resistance-LA List


IMC Network:

Original Cities

www.indymedia.org africa: ambazonia canarias estrecho / madiaq kenya nigeria south africa canada: hamilton london, ontario maritimes montreal ontario ottawa quebec thunder bay vancouver victoria windsor winnipeg east asia: burma jakarta japan korea manila qc europe: abruzzo alacant andorra antwerpen armenia athens austria barcelona belarus belgium belgrade bristol brussels bulgaria calabria croatia cyprus emilia-romagna estrecho / madiaq euskal herria galiza germany grenoble hungary ireland istanbul italy la plana liege liguria lille linksunten lombardia london madrid malta marseille nantes napoli netherlands nice northern england norway oost-vlaanderen paris/Île-de-france patras piemonte poland portugal roma romania russia saint-petersburg scotland sverige switzerland thessaloniki torun toscana toulouse ukraine united kingdom valencia latin america: argentina bolivia chiapas chile chile sur cmi brasil colombia ecuador mexico peru puerto rico qollasuyu rosario santiago tijuana uruguay valparaiso venezuela venezuela oceania: adelaide aotearoa brisbane burma darwin jakarta manila melbourne perth qc sydney south asia: india mumbai united states: arizona arkansas asheville atlanta austin baltimore big muddy binghamton boston buffalo charlottesville chicago cleveland colorado columbus dc hawaii houston hudson mohawk kansas city la madison maine miami michigan milwaukee minneapolis/st. paul new hampshire new jersey new mexico new orleans north carolina north texas nyc oklahoma philadelphia pittsburgh portland richmond rochester rogue valley saint louis san diego san francisco san francisco bay area santa barbara santa cruz, ca sarasota seattle tampa bay tennessee urbana-champaign vermont western mass worcester west asia: armenia beirut israel palestine process: fbi/legal updates mailing lists process & imc docs tech volunteer projects: print radio satellite tv video regions: oceania united states topics: biotech

Surviving Cities

www.indymedia.org africa: canada: quebec east asia: japan europe: athens barcelona belgium bristol brussels cyprus germany grenoble ireland istanbul lille linksunten nantes netherlands norway portugal united kingdom latin america: argentina cmi brasil rosario oceania: aotearoa united states: austin big muddy binghamton boston chicago columbus la michigan nyc portland rochester saint louis san diego san francisco bay area santa cruz, ca tennessee urbana-champaign worcester west asia: palestine process: fbi/legal updates process & imc docs projects: radio satellite tv
printable version - js reader version - view hidden posts - tags and related articles

“Iraq is a No-Win, No-End War!” - Max Cleland

by William Hughes Friday, Sep. 16, 2005 at 11:15 PM

On Sept. 15, 2005, a Congressional “Forum” was held on Capitol Hill in Washington, D.C. It was chaired by anti-Iraqi War advocate, Rep. Lynn Woolsey (D-CA). She accused the Bush-Cheney Gang of creating a “bloody and ruinous debacle,” in Iraq, and that it was long past the time to discuss exit strategies. Max Cleland, a witness at the Forum and a Vietnam War veteran, and ex-U.S. Senator, said, “Iraq is a No-Win, No-End War!”

  “Iraq is a No-Wi...
max_cleland.jpg, image/jpeg, 506x528

Washington, D.C. - On a very muggy, Thursday, September 15, 2005, a bipartisan Congressional “Forum” was convened at 10 AM, in Room 122 of the Cannon House Office Building. The hearing was chaired by Rep. Lynn Woolsey (D-CA), a strong critic of the Iraqi War. (1) Its purpose was to “break the silence on Capitol Hill and to discuss, ‘How to Bring the Troops Home,’” and also to help, “the Iraqis regain control over their country and their future.”

Woolsey was the first member of the U.S. Congress to call on the Bush-Cheney Gang to “develop and implement a plan to bring U.S. troops out of Iraq.” She has also urged that formal hearings be held by House committees, like the International Relations Committee and the U.S. House Armed Services Committee, in order to move this important matter forward. Her requests have been repeatedly ignored by both the White House and the GOP-controlled Congress. This is the primary reason why she had to organize today’s Forum, which included, too, a panel of five expert witnesses.

Woolsey, seated next to Rep. John Conyers (D-MI), continued with her opening statement, “Some of us have dissented from the very beginning, based on the belief that the doctrine of pre-emptive war is inhuman and immoral. Others were shocked that the administration’s rationale for war turned out to be based on dubious intelligence at best and outright lies at worst. Others became disillusioned by the Abu Ghraib outrage, or the failure to outfit our soldiers with proper body and vehicle armor.”

The Chairwoman, from Northern California, pointed out that the “last straw” in her evolving opposition to the Iraqi War was the “blinding incompetence of the war effort - the failure to prevent looting; the failure to secure munition sites; the dissolving of the Iraqi army; and the lack of an effective plan to secure the peace after the end of major operations.” Woolsey continued, “The question for us today is not the ‘why’ of troop withdrawal: it’s the ‘how’...We want to fill the policy vacuum...where, frankly, Members of Congress have been slow to embrace the fresh thinking and the new approaches to Iraq that their constituents are eager to hear. For too long, for a number of reasons, this debate has been ceded to the Bush Administration, even as it has produced a bloody and ruinous debacle.”

One of the most compelling witnesses at the Forum was ex-U.S. Sen. Max Cleland (D-GA), (1997-2003), who is also a veteran of the Vietnam War. (2) As an Army Captain in that blood-stained conflict, in 1968, Cleland was seriously wounded by a grenade explosion. It cost him both of his legs and his right arm. He was awarded the Bronze Star and a Silver Star for gallantry in action. During the administration of President Jimmy Carter, Cleland served admirably as the youngest head of the U.S. Veterans Administration.

“In terms of the Iraq War, I agree with my distinguished former colleague and Vietnam veteran, Sen. Chuck Hagel, that the war in Iraq is beginning to look a lot like Vietnam,” Cleland began his testimony. “As a matter of fact, I feel like I am living in a time warp!” He then detailed all of the similarities between the Vietnam War and the Iraqi conflict, while labeling Vietnam as “America’s worst foreign policy defeat.” He told how watching the Iraqi conflict unfold was, for him, like seeing the same “movie all over again,” but, that this time around, he just couldn’t stand by silently, “while thousands of American soldiers risk their lives - again - for a no-win, no-end war. Our military personnel are the bravest men and women I have ever seen go into harm’s way for this country,” Cleland emphasized.

Sitting on the panel with Cleland were: Gen. Joseph Hoard (Ret. USMC), an ex-commander-in-chief of the U.S. Central Command; David Mack, a former Ambassador to the United Arab Emirates; Mr. Anas Shallal, an Iraqi-American and a Sunni Muslim, associated with the “Peace Cafe,”; Dr. Ken Katzman, a Middle East analyst; and Professor Antonia Chaves, who had served in various Pentagon-related posts under the Carter administration.

Each of the panel members proposed various scenarios for a possible U.S. troop withdrawal from Iraq. Then, they answered questions from Chairwomen Woolsey and from other members of the House of Representatives who were present at the Forum, like: Rep. Charles Rangel (D-NY); Rep. Sam Farr (D-CA); Rep. Maurice Hinchey (D-NY; Rep. Lois Capps (D-NY; Rep. DeFazio (D-OR) and Rep. James McDermott (D-WA), to name just a few. Chairwomen Woolsey also make it a point in her opening statement to praise the work of California State Sen., Tom Hayden, for his “grass roots leadership” on the Iraqi War exit strategy issue. Hayden, who was seated next to me at the hearing, has long and close political ties to Maryland’s Green Party candidate for the U.S. Senate - the popular Kevin Zeese.

Getting back to Cleland. He underscored in his remarks, how, “we need an exit strategy we choose or it will certainly be chosen for us. The question about Iraq is not whether we will withdraw our forces, but when? More than 100 members out of the Iraqi Parliament have urged the U.S. to fully withdraw its military forces from Iraq. It is now time to seek what international support we can get for our withdrawal. We need to map out a strategy that works for us and turn Iraq over to the Iraqis.”

After discussing the Katrina Hurricane disaster and its horrific effects on the lives of the tens of thousands of people in the Gulf Coast area, Cleland said, “We are spending more money in Iraq then rebuilding New Orleans, Biloxi, Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama. It is time to bring our troops home-especially the National Guard that was created to guard America and to deal with disasters in our own country rather than being sent to die in the deserts in Iraq. It is time to put America first!”

I leave the final words on this excellently conceived and implemented Congressional “Forum,” to Cleland, one of the South’s finest sons, and a genuine hero of our Republic. He warned, “Iraq does not have to be another Vietnam. The war in Iraq does not have to drag on forever. It is not too late to learn from our own history. Why do I urge this course of action to our nation, now? Because I’ve seen this movie before. I know how it ends!”


1. Rep. Lynn Woolsey’s edited opening remarks at the hearing can be found in a video, here: http://homepage.mac.com/bhughes2/iMovieTheater147.html

2. Max Cleland’s edited testimony at the hearing can be found in a video, here: http://homepage.mac.com/bhughes2/iMovieTheater148.html

© William Hughes 2005.

William Hughes is the author of “Saying ‘’No’ to the War Party” (IUniverse, Inc.). He can be reached at liamhughes@comcast.net.

Report this post as:

Listed below are the 10 latest comments of 1 posted about this article.
These comments are anonymously submitted by the website visitors.
Iraq's NOT W's Vietnam DLi Saturday, Sep. 17, 2005 at 3:37 PM

Local News

Woolsey Fire: Worst News of 2018? J01 12:18AM

Oppose Environmentally-Harmful Development D10 4:03AM

Oppose Environmentally-Harmful Development D10 3:58AM

OUR HOUSE Grief Support Center Presents Night for Hope O30 5:38PM

Marshall Tuck’s racist dog whistle O27 5:01AM

Marshall Tuck’s ethnocentrism contradicts Californian values O27 4:32AM

Contra Costa-Hawkins O25 3:48AM

Debunking Some Anti-Prop 10 Propaganda O12 6:56AM

Why Should California Choose De Leon Over Feinstein? O10 9:55PM

Change Links September 2018 posted S02 10:22PM

More Scandals Rock Southern California Nuke Plant San Onofre A30 11:09PM

Site Outage Friday A30 3:49PM

Change Links August 2018 A14 1:56AM

Setback for Developer of SC Farm Land A12 11:09PM

More problems at Shutdown San Onofre Nuke J29 10:40PM

Change Links 2018 July posted J09 8:27PM

More Pix: "Families Belong Together," Pasadena J02 7:16PM

"Families Belong Together" March, Pasadena J02 7:08PM

Short Report on the Families Belong Together Protest in Los Angeles J30 11:26PM

More Local News...

Other/Breaking News




Paraphysique du burnout post-démocratique J23 9:06AM

911 : establishment terror J22 11:18PM

Actor Patrick Kilpatrick Discusses and Signs his New Book Dying for Living J22 10:42PM

The Attack of Corporations and the Rich on the Rest of Society J22 2:36PM

bataclown J22 12:32PM

bataclone J21 8:08PM


Mobile Royale Hack Online Generator - Get Unlimited Crystals J21 3:03PM

Unification, séparation et fragmentation J21 2:48PM

Testing Upload J21 7:10AM



Chemtrails and Prince J20 2:43PM

Wages For Housework J20 2:41PM

Tutelle comportementaliste J20 9:18AM

A Mistake: Jesse Jackson-Toyota deal-in Lexington -Ky is .8 billion over 10 years 2018 J20 1:17AM

If Trump Declares a AantionalEmergency, He'll Be Breaking the Law J20 12:47AM

Jesse Jackson's Sneak Attck on Toyota Lexington Ky and it's workers 2018 J19 9:12PM

Video: Chris Herdges in Eugene, 1 hr 24 min J19 5:37PM



Judge Delays Ruling on Puerto Rico Debt Deal White House Opposes Island's Food Assistance J18 6:04PM



Paraphysique de proxémie guerrière J18 7:59AM

More Breaking News...
© 2000-2018 Los Angeles Independent Media Center. Unless otherwise stated by the author, all content is free for non-commercial reuse, reprint, and rebroadcast, on the net and elsewhere. Opinions are those of the contributors and are not necessarily endorsed by the Los Angeles Independent Media Center. Running sf-active v0.9.4 Disclaimer | Privacy