I spent some time with a group of gentleman as a study. All of these men were from different parts of the middle east. All in different status from High ranking officers in there milatary to goverment officals. They have seen and lived with the beliefs of what the Muslim religion teach. They took me all the way back to Muhammad bin Qusim in 712 Ad all the way to 1947 when Pakistan came to be right up to today. The religion has been violent from day one. It is the only religion that teaches it's people to kill non-belivers. To a extreme muslim, if you do not belive, you are an infindel and must be killed. They told me that America is the only force that could stop people like Saddam and Osama and that it had to be done and that they agree with President Bush and respect him. They all agreed that it had to be done soon before the followers were too big of a force to be stoped by any one nation. They also all agreed that if Saddam or Osama could, they would kill every single person including children on this planet who is not a Muslim. While i realize and was reminded that not all Muslims are as extreme.

So it comes to this... The hollywood group is at it again Holding anti-war rallies,screaming about the Bush Administration,running ads in newspapers,defaming the President and his cabinet every chance they get, to anyone who will listen. They publicly defile them and call them names like stupid, morons,and idiots. Jessica Lange went as far as to say she was embarrassed to be an American.

So, just how ingorant are these people running the country? Let's look at the biographies of these stupid, ignorant leaders and then the celebrities who are castigating them.

President George W Bush: Recieved a Bachelors Degree from Yale University and an MBA from Harvord Business School. He served as an F-102 pilot for the Texas Air National Guard. He was elected Governor on November 8, 1994 with a 53.5 percent of the vote. In a historic re-election victory, he became the first Governor to be elected to consecutive four-year terms on November 3, 1998 winning 68.6 percent of the vote. In 1998 Governor Bush won 49 percent of the hispanic vote, 27 percent of the African-American vote, 27 percent of Democrats and 65 percent of women. He won more counties, 240 of 254 than any other Governor besides Richard Nixon and is the first Republican gubernatorial candidate to win the heavily Democratic border counties of El Paso, cameron and Hidalgo. (Someone began circulating a false story about his I.Q being lower than any other President. If you belive that you might want to go to URBANLEGENDS.COM and find out the truth.

Vice President Dick Cheney earned a B.A in 1965 and a M.A in 1966, both in political science ( Note, if you check the second group of biographies you wont find any degree's in political science) Two years later, he won an American Political Science Association congressional fellowship. One of Vice Presidents Cheney's primary duties is to share with individuals, members of congress and foreign leaders, to secure our homeland and win the war on terror. In his offical role as President of the Senate, The vice President regulary goes to Capitol Hill to meet with Senators and members of the House of Representatives to work on the Administration's legislative goals. In his travels as Vice President, he has seen first hand the great demands of our military.

Secretary of State Colin Powell was educated in the New York City public schools, graduating from the City Collage of New York (CCNY), where he earned a Bachelor's Degree in geology. He also participated on ROTC at CCNY and recieved a commission as an army second lieutenant upon graduation in June 1958. His further academic achievements include a Master of Business Administration Degree fron George Washington University. Secretary Powell is the recipient or numerous U.S and foreign military awards and decorations. Powell's civilian awards include two Presidential Medals of Freedom, the President's citizens Medal, and the Congressional Gold Medal, The secretary of state Distinguished Medal. Several schools and other institutions have been named in his honor and he holds honoary degrees from universities and collages across the country.

Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld: Attended Princeton Univ on Scholarship (AB, 1954) and served in the U.S Navy (1954-57) as a Naval avaitor; Congressional Assistant to Rep. Robert Griffen 1957-59. U.S Representative, illinois, 1962-69; Assistant to the President, Director of the office of Economic Opportunity, Director of the Cost of living Council, U.S ambassador to the President, Director of White House Office of Operations, White House Chief of Staff, 1974-77 Secretary of Defense, 1975-77

National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice: Enrolled at the University of Denver at the age of 15, graduating at 19 earning her bachelor's degree in political science, cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa, from the univ in 1974; her Master's from the univ of Notre Dame in 1975 and her Ph.D. from the Graduate School of international Studies at the univ of Denver in 1981. Both of her advanced degrees are also in Political Science. She has been awarded Doctoratets from Morehouse Collage, Univ of Alabama, and the Univ of Notre Dame. At Stanford, she has been a member of the Center for international Security and Arms Control, A senior Fellow of the institute for intrenational Studies, and a fellow of the Hoover institute. She has addressed audiences in settings ranging from the U.S Ambassadore Residence in Moscow to the Commonwealth Club to the National Conventions. From 1989 through March 1991 the period of German reunification and the final days of the Soviet Union, she she served as the director and the Senior Director of the Soviet and East European Affairs in the National Security Affairs. She served as special Assistant to the Director of The Joint Chiefs of Staff. In 1997 she served on the Federal Advisory Committee on Genger- integrated Training in the Military. She was a member of the Board of Directors for the Chevron Company, the Charles Schwap Corp, the Williams and Flora Hewlett Foundation, the Univ of Notre Dame, the International Advisory Council of J.P Morgan, and the San Francisco Symphony Board of Governors. She was a founding board member of the Center for a New Generation. Her past board service has encompassed such organizations as Transamerica corp, Hewlett Packard, the Carnegie Corp, Carnegie Endowment for international Peace, The Rand Corp, the Mid-Peninsula Urban Coalition and KQED.



Im just trying to figure out how all these celebrities and seems to be very uneducated people have all this inside information?? Who are these people? What is there education? What is their experience in affairs of State or in National Security? While i and our brave men and women who are proudly fighting for these people to express their opinions do belive they have the right. I think that if they are going to call into question the intelligence of our leaders, we should also have the facts on their educations and experience in Global and National affairs.

Barbra Striesand: Completed High School - Career Singing and acting

Cher: Dropped out of High School in the 9 th grade - Career Singing and acting

Martin Sheen: Flunked exam to enter University of Dayton - Career Acting

Jessica Lange Dropped out of college mid freshman year - Career Acting

Alec Baldwin Dropped out of George Washington Univ - Career Acting

Julia Roberts Completed high School - Career Acting

Sean Penn Completed high school - Career - Acting

Susan Sarandon Degree in DRAMA - Career Acting

Ed Asner Completed High school - career Acting

George Clooney Dropped out of Univ of Kentuckey Career - Acting

Michael Moore Dropped out of first year Univ of Michigan - Career Director

Sarah Jessica Parker Completed High school - Career- Acting

Jennifer Anniston Completed High school - Career Acting

Mike Farrell Completed High school - Career Acting

Janeane Garofelo Dropped out of collage - Career Stand up comedienne

Larry Hagaman attended Bard collage for one year - Career Acting

The list goes on and on...........



These celebrities have no intelligence - gathering agents, no fact finding groups, no insight into the minds of those who would destroy our country. They only have a deep seated hatred for all things Republican. By nature, and no one knows quite why. The Hollywood elitists detest Consertive views and anything that supports or uplifts the United States.

The silence was deafening from the left when Bill Clinton bommed a pharmaceutical factory outside Khartoum, or when he attacked the Bosnian Serbs in 1995 and 1999. He bomed Serbia itself to get Slobodan Milosevic out of Kosovo, and not a single peace ralley was held in Hollywood. When our Rangers were ambushed im Somalia and 18 young Amereican lives were lost, not a peep was heard from Hollywood. Yet not after our nation has been attacked on its own soil, after 3,000 Americans were killed by freedom hating terrorists while going about their routine lives, they want to hold rallies against the war. Why the change? Just becuse a Republican is in the White House. The same argument keeps coming up now, (Saddam had no ties with Osama!!) well if you listen to something besides CNN there is evidence of this. Another is (Where's the WMD's) This guy has had 10 years to sink bunkers in the vast dessert. You can't really belive that he just said (ok i give up i'll get rid of my weapons) Please. If we are to belive the word of a man that did unspeakable things to his own people, then we are truly sittings ducks.

Another irony is that in 1987, when Ronald Regan was in office, the Hollywood group aligned themselves with disarmament groups like SANE, FREEZE and PEACE ACTION, urging our own goverment to disarm. In order to promote world peace. It is courious that now, even when we know that Saddam has used chemical weapons and was trying to optain neuclear weapons, there was no cry from Hollywood for Saddam to disarm. They belived we should just have left him alone in his quest for these weapons even though it was certian sooner or later they would find there way to our city's and make 9/11 look like a walk in the park. Once again if we are to belive that would'nt have happend then we are truly sitting ducks. Why didn't Saddam use WMD's in the initial invasion? Well we can start with (1) There was writted documents from Russia, France and Germany stating they would disconnect all ties with Saddam should he use anything but conventional weapons. I'm sure you can still find this on the Drudge report. (2) Saddam was told should he use WMD'S that a nuclear attack would be used. Therefor he would no longer have an impire to fall back on. His only hope was for his allies (in witch they had investmints with Saddam) would stop the invasion. Should anyone want to detest any of this information feel free to investigate and gather information on this such as i have for the last year.

So why the hype out of Hollywood? Could these celebrities belive that since they draw such astronomical salaries, they are intitled to also determine the corse of our Nation? That they can make a viable decisions concerning war and peace? Did Micheal Moore have the backing of the Nation when he thanked France? Does Sean Penn fancy himself a Diplomat (or just a DIP) in going to Iraq when we were just weeks away from war? Does he belive that his High School Diploma gives him the knowlage to go to a country that is controlled by a maniacal dictator, and speak on behalf of the American people? Or is it the fact that he pulls in more money in one year that the average American worker will see in a lifetime ( the arogance is astrronomical) Does his bank account or the fact that he has played in a few movies give him clout? It's all truly amazing!!!!

The ultimate irony is that many of these celebrities have made a shambles of their own lives, with drug abuse, alcoholism, numerous marriages and divorces, scrapes with the law, publicized temper tantrums, exc. How dare they pretend they know whats best for an entire nation!! What is even more bizzarre is how many people will listen and accept their views, simpley becuse they liked them in a certian movie, or have fond memories of an old t.v sitcom.

It is time for us as citizens of the nation to educate ourselves about the world around us. If future generations are going to enjoy the freedoms that our forefathers bequeathed us, if they are ever to know peace in their country and their world, to live without fear of terrorism striking in their cities, we must assure that this nation remains strong. We must make certian that those who would destroy us are made aware of the severe consequences that will befall them.

Yes it is a wonderfull dream to sit down with dictator and terrorists and join hands, singing Cumbaya and talking of world peace. We did not stop Adolf Hitler from taking over the entire continent of Europe by simply talking to him. We sent our best and bravest that this country is known for. President John F Kennedy did not stop the Soviet ships from unloading their neclear missiles in Cuba in 1962 with words. He stopped them with action, and the threat of immediate war if the ships did not turn around. We did not end the cold war with conferences. It ended with the strong belief of President Ronald Reagan.....PEACE through STRENGTH.

you get what you pay for, Thank the CIA.

seems to me it's a whole lot more than ( is this the best you got? ) just goes to show ( and i'll take a small exerpt from my orginal posting ) how the point is proven...... ( Im just trying to figure out how all these celebrities and seems to be very uneducated people )

I said, thank the CIA for Saddam. Did you think he grew from a Bush?

Rumor has it that Mohammed, A citizen of America, (TM) is Arnold Schwarzenegger's gay lover.

Bush Admirer is jumping in to defend the drivel he posted.

"sob" - You said - "I said, thank the CIA for Saddam."

Your accusation is flatly WRONG. The CIA had NOTHING to do with Saddam Hussein's rise to power. That's a fact, Poindexter. SH rose to power after he attempted to kill the president of Iraq in 1959. The Baath party knew he was aggressive and ruthless and, quite frankly, they feared him. He again attempted a coup in 1968, and, in 1979, the Baath party 'let' him assume the leadership role.

I challenge you to show, conclusively, any CIA involvement in the rise of SH to power. Nineteen Seventy Nine is your cutoff point.

You won't be able to do it... Not because facts are facts, but because you don't have the capacity to process simple facts.

Mohammeds' article is, IN FACT, FACTUALLY CORRECT.

So you have 2 choices, SOB: Either show that the CIA was directly involved with the rise of SH to power between 1968 and 1979 OR: Show that what Mohammed has said is WRONG.



You'd better study your history and FACTS before you respond because if you don't I'll be more than happy to rip your 'argument' to pieces' Get busy.

This Christmas night I hoist to you, my friend!

...Reality Check

you're kidding me, right?

Are you ignorant or stupid or lazy?

Got to be one or all of the above. Are you ill?

come back after you learn to read or use a search engine on your own, away from your keeper. nit wit

-prove CIA involvement.-

-have confirmed with me this current operation snitzhelkrieg.

Ask them yourself; they're over there in the corner, face the lens.

Saddam Key in Early CIA Plot

While many have thought that Saddam first became involved with U.S. intelligence agencies at the start of the September 1980 Iran-Iraq war, his first contacts with U.S. officials date back to 1959, when he was part of a CIA-authorized six-man squad tasked with assassinating then Iraqi Prime Minister Gen. Abd al-Karim Qasim.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/10/205859.shtml

How the west helped Saddam gain power and decimate the Iraqi elite

Iraqis have always suspected that the 1963 military coup that set Saddam Husain on the road to absolute power had been masterminded by the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). New evidence just published reveals that the agency not only engineered the putsch but also supplied the list of people to be eliminated once power was secured - a monstrous stratagem that led to the decimation of Iraq's professional class.

http://www.muslimedia.com/archives/features98/saddam.htm

Regime Change: How the CIA put Saddam's Party in Power

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html

The link you provided only shows 2 documents, neither of which pertain to Saddams power grab. One is about the Iran-Iraq war and the other is about his use of chemical weapons.

Saddam-Baath Fascists’ Long-Time Love Affair with the CIA

"…in the past Saddam was seen by U.S. intelligence services as a bulwark of anti-communism and they used him as their instrument for more than 40 years..."

http://www.plp.org/comm03/1saddamncia.html

Saddam Key in Early CIA Plot

While many have thought that Saddam first became involved with U.S. intelligence agencies at the start of the September 1980 Iran-Iraq war, his first contacts with U.S. officials date back to 1959, when he was part of a CIA-authorized six-man squad tasked with assassinating then Iraqi Prime Minister Gen. Abd al-Karim Qasim.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/10/205859.shtml

How the west helped Saddam gain power and decimate the Iraqi elite

Iraqis have always suspected that the 1963 military coup that set Saddam Husain on the road to absolute power had been masterminded by the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). New evidence just published reveals that the agency not only engineered the putsch but also supplied the list of people to be eliminated once power was secured - a monstrous stratagem that led to the decimation of Iraq's professional class.

http://www.muslimedia.com/archives/features98/saddam.htm

Regime Change: How the CIA put Saddam's Party in Power

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html

(Apologies, sob, for borrowing your handle, but unReality Fleck either has me on his ignore list, or would prefer to just quibble with you and go on ignoring reality. Hopefully he learned something about the chemical weapons that Reagan, Rumsfeld, and daddy Bush helped him acquire.) - S&B

please don't sweat it.

you think it's because they don't know? (laugh)

these worms are reading the slogans to see if the knowledge of their weak and tired lie is still showing any credence.

the Saddam devil was a CIA creation. these sob pieces are the usual white wash to see if it sticks, chaff.

It always fucks them over to remind them of how the evil came to be in the first place. They just hope their thin lies are not examined.

I, for one, don't follow what the celebrities say. (I must confess I think Garafalo is cute, and did watch Lou Grant back in the 70s, but that's it.) There are conservative as well as liberal actors and directors, but, there are more liberals mainly because actors and directors are workers who earn their pay from their talent. The CEOs tend to be conservative.

Simple as that, generally.

Moreover, most of the "news" on TV is about celebrity worship. (Even right-wing TV is about worshipping policy wonk celebrites and pseudo-journalists like Rush and O'Reilly.) The media is just doing what it always does - ignoring "real issues" and focusing on "celebrities." By doing this, the media abrogate their journalistic role in Democracy, and let the people in power (aka, they who own everything) do whatever the hell they want with/to us.

Most of the high-up folks in Washington, liberal or conservative, are pretty smart. Bush is unique because he really *isn't* smart. Cheney is smart. Powell is smart - probably a genius. Rumsfeld is smart. Smart isn't that special there, but average is, and Bush is average in intelligence.

(BTW, Clinton is probably a genius. It works for Democrats too.)

I think what makes this administration foolish is their adherence to whacked-out thinking coming from two sources: born again Christianity, and neoconservatives. I think that's what people are afraid of.

First off, I don't know who Bush's "guru" is, but he's being fed some weird apocalypic visions of holy wars, and making foreign policy decisions under the influence.

Second, the neocons are creepy. They used to be defenders of Stalin, then became ardent conservatives, pro-America, anti-Islam, but continued to be extremely jingoistic and euro-centric (and racist).

Mix these things together, and you get a big, heaping, steaming hot mound of stupid!

Here's a good example. What do you get when the Moonies buy up a lame paper and turn it onto a conservative organ? Paranoia and Hate in black and white. The Washington Times. Jesus says "peace" but the paper says "war"; Moon says "one world" but the paper says "shoot immigrants"; the paper says "freedom" but the conservatives say "USA PATRIOT".

[...sob...[ wrote:

"please don't sweat it.

you think it's because they don't know? (laugh)"

"these worms are reading the slogans to see if the knowledge of their weak and tired lie is still showing any credence. the Saddam devil was a CIA creation. these sob pieces are the usual white wash to see if it sticks, chaff. It always fucks them over to remind them of how the evil came to be in the first place. They just hope their thin lies are not examined."

I keep wanting to poke the shills with a stick, just to see if there's anything alive in there. They've been shuffling this GOP vs. Hollywood shit around for at least a couple of years. What I expected, based on the header, was an account of how Mohammed, A citizen of America's (TM) parents were victimized by Saddam.

I guess that was just a teaser.

Hey, why are you still here, sob? You're supposed to be hiding in a corner by now. ;-)

more rational wrote:

"...the neocons are creepy. They used to be defenders of Stalin, then became ardent conservatives, pro-America, anti-Islam, but continued to be extremely jingoistic and euro-centric (and racist)."

The neocons are pro-empire, not pro-America, don't you think?

"Mix these things together, and you get a big, heaping, steaming hot mound of stupid!"

Isn't it amazing how these geniuses can crank out a steaming hot mound of stupid? There's a method...

Interesting post, IMHO.

Thank you for the kind words and some of the not so kind words. Well,as what usaually happinds with my studies people have leaned so far off the left that they have fallen over and veared off the point. It went from how the uninformed people do not understand, to how the CIA helped Saddam get to power ( in witch the notion is so far untrue that i wont even address it, just another one of those those made up and snowballed so out of control that people have writted articals about and people want to belive so bad they do) and some other jibberish that i'm not really sure what it protains to. As to how i know about this i have made it my life's work to understand why my Fathers death came to be. The story is long but in short my Father was in the regular army (not under his own will) He had seen and had i the utter brutality of what some people might consider hell. My Father was torcherd for 6 monthes daily and finally put in a gas chamber as people watched like it was some kind of party. Only by the grace of my Grandfather were my Mother and myself able to escape what was sure to be our own demise. We don't know what happend to my Grandparents we have never heard from them since. The fact is what i have learned is that in America people on the Left want to belive so badly that Mr Bush is trying to make some kind of evil empire, belive me when i say people here have no idea what an evil empire is as i have seen it my self. They want to belive it so bad that they truly belive that everything is a conspericy. Already i hear that the incident in France was one. If that were the case wouldnt that make France a part of this whole conspericy? If the whole war was one wouldnt that make the other 60 countrys involved? The notion is quite silly. I know that no matter what i say will not change some peoples minds, but thats the beauty of your country that i have so imbraced. I would have been killed for saying or even thinking such things in Iraq. I am now truly blessed to be able to either detist or embrace my new found goverment weather it be rep or dem as of before i had no choice. Either way i know now the reality of freedom. Bless this country and those who lead it. So that you will NEVER know the horrors of the oppisite.

Thank you for the kind words and some of the not so kind words.Well,as what usaually happinds with my studies people have leaned so far off the left that they have fallen over and veared off the point. It went from how the uninformed people do not understand, to how the CIA helped Saddam get to power ( in witch the notion is so far untrue that i wont even address it, just another one of those those made up and snowballed so out of control that people have writted articals about and people want to belive so bad they do) and some other jibberish that i'm not really sure what it protains to. As to how i know about this i have made it my life's work to understand why my Fathers death came to be. The story is long but in short my Father was in the regular army (not under his own will) He had seen and had i the utter brutality of what some people might consider hell. My Father was torcherd for 6 monthes daily and finally put in a gas chamber as people watched like it was some kind of party. Only by the grace of my Grandfather were my Mother and myself able to escape what was sure to be our own demise. We don't know what happend to my Grandparents we have never heard from them since. The fact is what i have learned is that in America people on the Left want to belive so badly that Mr Bush is trying to make some kind of evil empire, belive me when i say people here have no idea what an evil empire is as i have seen it my self. They want to belive it so bad that they truly belive that everything is a conspericy. Already i hear that the incident in France was one. If that were the case wouldnt that make France a part of this whole conspericy? If the whole war was one wouldnt that make the other 60 countrys involved? The notion is quite silly. I know that no matter what i say will not change some peoples minds, but thats the beauty of your country that i have so imbraced. I would have been killed for saying of even thinking such things in Iraq. I am now truly blessed to be able to either detist or embrace my new found goverment weather it be rep or dem as of before i had no choice. Either way i know now the reality of freedom. Bless this country and those who lead it. So that you will NEVER know the horrors of the oppisite.

Because you silly shill you cannot ( and I do mean shill. aka MACofA), and your frail and flimsey tale of woe and spin are just too pathetic. -sob-

But look, you have convinced Bush Admirer and NRP! Doing well so far...

this latest desperate river of crockadile tears is falling so flat after your side's bloodlust for the kill...

You even have to bring the spin from one of our preported victims. The people are finding out who was pulling the string to your piece of horror. Thank you, S & B, I just get tired of these selective memory types and have gone down this WELL traveled road. - look-... see?

they already forgot.

[...sob...] wrote:

"look... see? they already forgot."

In April of 1984, Oceania is at war with Eurasia; citizens must force themselves to "remember" that they have always been at war with Eurasia, despite the fact that Oceania was allied with Eurasia only four years before. Failure to control their thoughts using doublethink, would result in thoughtcrime.

http://www.bookrags.com/notes/1984/TOP3.htm

In violation of the Geneva Protocol of 1925 (that outlaws chemical warfare), the Reagan-Bush administration authorized the sale of poisonous chemicals and deadly biological viruses, from anthrax to bubonic plague, throughout the 80’s. In 1982, while Saddam Hussein constructed his machinery of war, Reagan and Bush removed Iraq from the State Department list of terrorist states.

As special envoy for Reagan and Bush, Donald Rumsfeld met with Saddam in December, 1983, to offer U.S. support, trade, and military backing in Iraq's brutal war against Iran, during which millions of civilians were slaughtered.

The Pentagon supplied logistical and military support, U.S. banks provided billions of dollars in credits, and the C.I.A., using a Chilean conduit, increased Saddam's supply of cluster bombs. U.S. companies also supplied steel tubes and chemical substances, the types of material for which the Security Council is now searching.

As late as 1989 and 1990, U.S. companies, under permits from the first Bush administration, sent mustard gas precursors, live cultures for bacteriological research, to Iraq. U.S. companies helped Iraq build a chemical weapons factory, and then shipped Hussein a West Nile virus, hydrogen cyanide precursors, and parts for a new nuclear plant.

When Saddam's atrocities fulfilled U.S. strategic aims, U.S. war supplies and Media rationalizations flowed like wine. And many of the public officials and editors who call for all-out war today are the same chameleons that supported and rationalized Saddam's war crimes in the 80’s.

http://www.cascobayweekly.com/cbw2003/columns/fromwhereisit01.30.03.stm

"'Who controls the past, controls the future: who controls the present controls the past.'"

"Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia."

In 1990, the monster that the U.S. helped to create started to turn on its master, so moral outrage against Saddam Hussein was once again in the U.S.’s interest.

http://www.creativeresistance.ca/world-awareness/2002-sept06-dick-cheney-supports-war-on-iraq.htm

"…in the past Saddam was seen by U.S. intelligence services as a bulwark of anti-communism and they used him as their instrument for more than 40 years..."

http://www.plp.org/comm03/1saddamncia.html

"WAR IS PEACE

FREEDOM IS SLAVERY

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH."

DOWN WITH BIG BROTHER