{"article":{"id":142640,"heading":"Israel is the reason America is at war","author":"USBEFOREISRAEL","created":"2005-12-27 09:04:54","modified":"2006-01-06 03:32:23","last_modified":"Fri, 06 Jan 2006 11:32:23","article":"

Fw: Israel is the reason America is at war:



http:\/\/www.itszone.co.uk\/zone0\/viewtopic.php?t=46347<\/a>



Israel's War Deadline\/Iran in the Crosshairs:



http:\/\/www.warwithoutend.co.uk\/zone0\/viewtopic.php?t=46357<\/a><\/p>\n","contact":"","link":"http:\/\/nomorewarforisrael.blogspot.com","address":"","phone":"","parent_id":0,"mime_type":"text\/plain","summary":"Fw: Israel is the reason America is at war","numcomment":96,"fileurl":"\/uploads\/","filesize":null,"article_url":"\/news\/2005\/12\/142640.php"},"attachments":[],"comments":[{"id":142646,"heading":"Millions know this ...","article":"...but the Zionist media would rather you think it was about oil. Saddam never refused to sell us oil and less than 25% of our oil comes from the entire middle east. www.nowarforisrael.com","author":"American Insurgent","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"image\/jpeg","created":"2005-12-27 11:41:34","modified":"2005-12-27 11:41:34","fileurl":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/nowarforisrael.jpg","image":{"original":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/nowarforisrael.jpg"}},{"id":142650,"heading":"this is what I mean","article":"Look at the capital sectors involved in this sudden new and deliberate backlash as the NYT [spit ] begins to inform the public of these belated disclosures after decades of pleasant slumber and willing complacency as the guardians of truth for the CIA.\r\nYou really ought to read my little muse:\r\nhttp:\/\/la.indymedia.org\/news\/2005\/11\/140166.php\r\nI worry about this sick little lamb as we all should be. \r\nMay the secret service give him better protection than they did on 9-11.\r\nThe CIA through its well established old money connections is ratting out the Neocon Zionist involvement in this present catastrophy.and during these times when the factions of devision in the ruling class occurs we should all pull up a lawn chair with a good rifle across our knees and watch the show. Just like the 4th of July.\r\n:>)","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 16:40:31","modified":"2005-12-27 16:40:31","fileurl":""},{"id":142655,"heading":"Maybe...","article":"If we had wanted to go to war for Isreal we would have done it during the first Gulf War, when Iraq actually fired missiles into Isreal. We could have taken out Saddam then, but we didn't. We should have. \r\n\r\nIf 9\/11 hadn't happened Saddam would most likely still be in power today. I'm not saying he was directly responsible for 9\/11, because he wasn't. But post 9\/11 he was properly seen as the infection he was in the Middle East and needed to be removed (and should have been long before). \r\n\r\nAll of that said, the US is not directly defending Isreal here. If our intent was to directly defend Isreal we'd be all over Iran and Syria right now. \r\n\r\nShould Isreal ever come under direct attack again then we should defend them. They were a crucial ally during the cold war and still are in the war on terror. They are the ONLY mature democracy in the middle east and should be defended against the theocratic dictatorships and totalitarian socialist states that surround them. Isreal isn't perfect, but it's a damn site better than the goons that surround them. \r\n\r\nBut by all means... let your seething hatred of Jews be your guide to geoplitical events.","author":"Tramp","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 18:30:35","modified":"2005-12-27 18:30:35","fileurl":""},{"id":142665,"heading":"there's an old saying...","article":"Okay, not that old.\r\nInfamy is to create two lies and get people to fight over which one is true.\r\n(paraphrased, I'm sure )\r\n\r\nThis is not about '19 savage arabs' this is about that colony of cutthroats in Palestine. And maybe why your lies are ubiquitous. And why ownership is so consolidated. Now the CIA sector of old banking capital that views inflation and debt finance a road to ruin [ at least to their particular assets ] is calling artillery in on the Neocons. This is what this attack on the cabal in the reigns of nominal power now, don't realize and what it's all about.\r\nThis certainly isn't about people of the Jewish faith. Although they most likely may get caught up in the ruin because of squawking like the previous one by 'Tramp'.","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 20:38:31","modified":"2005-12-27 20:38:31","fileurl":""},{"id":142667,"heading":"Did Israel Lead the US into the War on Iraq?","article":"See:\r\n\r\nwww.jewishvoiceforpeace.org\/publish\/article_237.shtml","author":"pointer","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 20:57:09","modified":"2005-12-27 20:57:09","fileurl":""},{"id":142673,"heading":"Sheepdip","article":"You said: "... that colony of cutthroats in Palestine" \r\n\r\nI congradulate you for one of the best descriptions EVER of the barbarians we all know as 'Palestinians'. ","author":"Tramp","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 21:20:58","modified":"2005-12-27 21:20:58","fileurl":""},{"id":142676,"heading":"pointer","article":"That link proves NOTHING. \r\n\r\nThe US and Israel share some common foreign policy goals. So what? So does the US and Saudi Arabia. Or Canada, or Mexico or even Iran as it pertains to the removal of Saddam. That proves nothing.\r\n\r\nNetenyahu's paper discussing the removal of Saddam also proves nothing. Nor does the presence of Jews in our Gov't. Bush is a Christian... how do you know this wasn't a war for Christians?\r\n\r\nI thought Bush went into Iraq for...\r\n\r\n1) Oil\r\n2) To avenge the assassination attempt on his father\r\n3) Because 'God told him so'\r\n4) To line the pockets of Halliburton\r\n5) Because he 'hates the brown people'\r\n6) Because he wants to wage a 'war against Islam'\r\n\r\n This "War for Israel" thoery is just one more in a list of other crackpot ideas from the functionally illiterate, socialist Left. The bottom line is that the Left wants to see Israel, like it wants to see the US, weak and ineffectual in world affairs. It believes that both the US and Israel are just too darned big for their britches.\r\n\r\nThe sad part is that they are willing to openly support groups like Hamas and Islamic Jihad to achieve this goal. Along with those groups they quietly, and sometimes not so quietly, cheered 9\/11. \r\n\r\n\r\nThis is derived from a schoolyard sense of justice and a petty hatred of success and capitalism. There's no moral thought whatsoever in any of it.\r\n\r\nBut you keep on supporting those who'd like nothing more than to saw your head off and burn your country to the ground.","author":"Tramp","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 21:35:33","modified":"2005-12-27 21:35:33","fileurl":""},{"id":142677,"heading":"Don't look at THAT link.","article":"you mean This One?\r\nhttp:\/\/www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org\/publish\/article_237.shtml\r\nThanks Tramp I believe I will. \r\nAnd the night has a thousand eyes.","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 22:15:53","modified":"2005-12-27 22:15:53","fileurl":""},{"id":142678,"heading":"The point ( one of them ) I'm making","article":"The point that I'm making is that it's a losing fight against the old money and its media. These disclosures are merely opening shots, I believe to involve the Zionists that are operating in their own interests against these old banking capital investments in some very deep and bloody shit.\r\n This crap is getting too dangerous with collateral damage the only card they can throw, at all of us, too easily turned to high level N.B.C. warfare.\r\nHey I live here and so do you. [?]","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-27 22:43:22","modified":"2005-12-27 22:43:22","fileurl":""},{"id":142682,"heading":"Abso-fuckin-lutely!","article":""The bottom line is that the Left wants to see Israel, like it wants to see the US, weak and ineffectual in world affairs. It believes that both the US and Israel are just too darned big for their britches."\r\n\r\nA perfect summation of this phenomena.\r\n\r\nThe left sees Israel and the US as the "rich white guys" of the world community and therefore they must be vanquished. And there is definetly a level of anti-semitism involved as well.\r\n\r\nIt is truly amazing the lengths at which the left does, in fact, support and defend any and all enemies of these two regardless of how these very same entities are at complete odds with supposed liberal values.\r\n\r\nFor instance the complete inclusion of Church AS state.\r\nComplete and utter absence of womens' rights.\r\nZero rights for gays and lesbians.\r\n\r\nWell, you know the story.\r\n\r\nAll things that the left would become apoplectic over if committed by white Christians or Jews.\r\n\r\nAll in all, the lefts hatred of the US and Israel is stunningly transparent and pretty fucking silly.\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 01:03:39","modified":"2005-12-28 01:03:39","fileurl":""},{"id":142684,"heading":"question:","article":"do you weasels get paid by the word or what?","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 01:53:43","modified":"2005-12-28 01:53:43","fileurl":""},{"id":142688,"heading":"2nd question","article":"My question is just how deep the Mossad is involved in the entire mess. Not that there isn't plenty of involvement to go around to everyone.\r\nThis is like a Mexican standoff with blackmail vs. blackmail. It can only be instructive as the pressure builds.","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 03:35:50","modified":"2005-12-28 03:35:50","fileurl":""},{"id":142689,"heading":"Speaking on terms of anonymity...","article":"For Tramp and the rest of the Israeli lobby:\r\n\r\nWe didn't invade Iraq in Gulf War 1 because we thought Saddam really did have serious biological warheads and we didn\u2019t want to risk the lives of millions of Israelis by going ahead. You see, there are some biological agents that not even the best masks in the world will save you from. We only decided to invade Iraq after we were sure that Iraq \u201cdid not\u201d have these particular agents. The general hypothesis was that Saddam was ready to begin the manufacture of advanced biological weapons that could be used on Israel rather discreetly. This was also the notion pushed by AIPAC and other pro-Israeli lobbies. It was this constant drum beat that has us there now, not 9-11. The Forward, America\u2019s leading Jewish propaganda mill next to the mainstream, used to run radio ads saying \u201cWill America act before Saddam creates a weapon of mass destruction?\u201d I don\u2019t want to say that other lobbies are not strong, but the Mossad is the only foreign intelligence \u201callowed\u201d to operate on the \u201clevel\u201d that they do in America. \r\n\r\nIsrael and democracy. Don\u2019t inhale. If you were a Palestinian \u201cremoved\u201d in 1947, not only could you not return but you couldn\u2019t vote if you did. Okay, it\u2019s a democracy but only if you\u2019re Jewish. Moszeltov.\r\n\r\nRight now plans are being made to attack Iran. We have already given Israel \u201cbunker busters\u2019 for the job but we still can\u2019t quite figure out if Iran hasn\u2019t already gotten a few nuclear missiles from \u201cfriendly countries\u201d. If Iran is not hit in the coming months it will be because the intelligence isn\u2019t finalized on this point. Will Russia and Pakistan get involved? In my humble opinion, we have never been closer to World War Three. \r\n\r\nIsrael has nuclear weapons. Their reactor is in Dimona. They dump the radio-active waste in Nablus. What a nice thing to do to the Holy land. Why does Israel want to be the only ones in the middle east with nuclear weapons? How about this; The Al Aqsa mosque is in disrepair and when one of the walls happen to fall in or \u201csomething else\u201d happens to it, the Jews will start on the reconstruction of Solomon\u2019s Temple on top of one of the most sacred sites in Islam, the Dome of the Rock. Just think of the possibilities.\r\n\r\nWe should take Neturi Karta\u2019s advice, www.nkusa.org, and peacefully dismantle the Zionist state before its too late. However, it probably is. Shalom. \r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n","author":"The Mole","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 05:45:30","modified":"2013-11-11 00:37:15","fileurl":""},{"id":142696,"heading":"thank you","article":"Thanks for the interesting input, The Mole.\r\nfresca is up late.","author":"Sheepdog","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 07:21:20","modified":"2005-12-28 07:21:20","fileurl":""},{"id":142697,"heading":"War for Oil","article":"I think it's the other way around. America's support for Israel is driven by America's need for oil, and to influence politics in the Middle East.\r\n\r\nWhy else would the US and Europe fund a Jewish state? For the first half of the 20th century, Europeans were killing Jews, and American's weren't exactly fans of Judaism either. At the time, many Americans barely liked Catholics!","author":"johnk","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 07:37:16","modified":"2005-12-28 08:39:53","fileurl":""},{"id":142704,"heading":"sure it's for oil","article":"But mostly it's about who gets to use that oil.\r\nAnd pipelines to their intended sink, protected and administered by U.S. military power.\r\nEven if it's over a radioactive landscape.","author":"among other things","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 16:19:15","modified":"2005-12-28 16:19:15","fileurl":""},{"id":142707,"heading":"An answer again","article":"The truth of this post seems to lead to it's deletion.\r\n\r\nThere's no other reason for it.\r\n\r\nIt makes no value judgements. It simply states observable facts.\r\n\r\n**************************\r\n\r\n\r\n"Why does Israel want to be the only ones in the middle east with nuclear weapons?"\r\n\r\nBecause Israel is surrounded by a barbaric culture, comprising several states that exist to annhilate all jews.\r\n\r\nSo, of course, they want to be heavily armed.\r\n\r\nIn addition, they are the only civilized state in the middle east and therefore the only state capable of handling such weapons.\r\n\r\nOne would hope that they have many, many, many such weapons as well as numerous conventional armaments.\r\n\r\nThese are absolute savages that surround them.\r\n\r\nYou on the left need to wake the fuck up and smell the coffee. Your heroes are simply backwards, racist, murderers.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-28 17:51:39","modified":"2005-12-28 17:51:39","fileurl":""},{"id":142734,"heading":"no need","article":"Why even waste the effort at dismantling that vicious little Zionist outpost.\r\nWe could just let it starve. Wall them in and let them starve. Let them make their own way without using US arms and equipment. Give them a taste of Palestinian life.","author":"smeeble","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-29 01:55:04","modified":"2005-12-29 01:55:04","fileurl":""},{"id":142739,"heading":"maybe walls are not a good idea","article":"We could just cease giving them arms and money. Obviously they have walls.","author":"smeeble","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-29 02:37:10","modified":"2005-12-29 02:37:10","fileurl":""},{"id":142760,"heading":"how true","article":"This could not be anymore true.\r\n>These are absolute savages that surround them<\r\n\r\nAnd the rightful owners of these stolen lands have to endure this fact.\r\nWithout an Army or an Airforce, without tanks or helicopters, they survive\r\nconstant assault. Capricious killing, constant humiliation and imprisonment. On their own land.\r\nNo matter how often and numbingly repetitious the zionists want us to believe they were never a people, culture or nation of their own \r\nIt's the unrelenting chant of lies that allow the Palestinians to be slaughtered at the whim of the zionist nation because these " Israelites" feel it's their privilege to cage and massacre the people of these stolen lands. Their lies are their most monstrous weapon, after their nuclear arsenal. They continue to degrade and crush the real Palestinian victims.\r\nAll the while bleating about their right to lie and steal and murder. ","author":"Coker 7% solution.","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-29 14:56:18","modified":"2005-12-29 14:56:18","fileurl":""},{"id":142768,"heading":"Please","article":"Please provide ANY substantial evidence that History has recorded any record of a "Palestinian" people, their own language, goverment, culture.\r\n\r\nAnything.\r\n\r\nThere simply is none.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-29 17:03:08","modified":"2005-12-29 17:03:08","fileurl":""},{"id":142770,"heading":"'Who's going to build the wall?'","article":"Walls ,they have. Just cut off their foreign aid, until the zionazis shrivel into dust.","author":"like -duh","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-29 17:27:39","modified":"2005-12-29 17:27:39","fileurl":""},{"id":142869,"heading":"Racist Language","article":"The post got hidden because it got flagged. I think it was for the language in the post.\r\n\r\nIsrael is descibed as "civilized".\r\n\r\nMuslims are described as "barbaric" "savages" "backwards".","author":"johnk","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-30 23:58:33","modified":"2005-12-30 23:58:33","fileurl":""},{"id":142900,"heading":"Re: fresca","article":""by fresca Wednesday, Dec. 28, 2005 at 9:03 AM\r\nPlease provide ANY substantial evidence that History has recorded any record of a "Palestinian" people, their own language, goverment, culture."\r\n\r\nThis website might help you, http:\/\/www.palestineremembered.com\/index.html\r\n\r\n\r\n \r\n","author":"New World Order Resistance","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"image\/gif","created":"2005-12-31 14:57:03","modified":"2005-12-31 14:57:03","fileurl":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/boycott_israel.gifdyonyu.gif","image":{"original":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/boycott_israel.gifdyonyu.gif"}},{"id":142906,"heading":"Thanks","article":"Thanks for the link. But it's just yet another site without any evidence that there has ever been a true "palestinian" culture. No culture to differentiate it from other arabs. No language of it's own. No state. Nothing.\r\n\r\nI understand that the term "palestinian" refers to the people in question in Israel, but it's simply a term of convenience. \r\n\r\nThere is simply no such thing as a "palestinian" as the term refering to an actual people.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 18:05:47","modified":"2005-12-31 18:05:47","fileurl":""},{"id":142908,"heading":""Racist Language"","article":""Muslims are described as "barbaric" "savages" "backwards"."\r\n\r\nAre you trying to say they're not?\r\n\r\nYeah, right.","author":"what a pantload","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 18:23:15","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142909,"heading":"here's the deal","article":"There is no people known as 'jews' because it is a faith not an ethnic set.\r\nNotice how zionazis always shout the most blatant, loudest lies.\r\nWe can view 'fresca's words as the exact opposite of the truth.\r\nI have an 1935 illuminated globe on which Palestine is clearly marked as a nation.\r\nFresca hopes history will forget. The Zionazis are busy destroying any and all records to sustain this lie and Hitler was right. One genocide is like any other genocide as long as the international outrage can be covered over. The Zionazis surely remember all the things they learned while working with Eiechmann and this is just another tactic in the murder game.\r\n","author":"Factor","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 18:23:37","modified":"2005-12-31 18:23:37","fileurl":""},{"id":142910,"heading":"Palis","article":"If Palestinians or, more broadly, radical Muslims, are described as "barbaric" "savages" "backwards" its probably because...\r\n\r\nThey commit suicide bombing EVERY SINGLE DAY.\r\n\r\nThey created that pillar of civilisation we all know and love... THE TALIBAN.\r\n\r\nThey routinely saw the heads off of people.\r\n\r\nThey routinely commit honor killings.\r\n\r\nThey openly declare their love of death.\r\n\r\n... ad nauseum...\r\n\r\nSo, based on their very well establish track record, I'd say that terms such as "barbarian" aren't far off the mark. If we are willing to call Hitler a "barbarian" and a "savage" then we are certainly justified in using those terms with regard to radical Muslims, and that includes the Palestinians, who are the locus of much of this violence.","author":"Tramp","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 18:28:40","modified":"2005-12-31 18:28:40","fileurl":""},{"id":142916,"heading":"Palestine?","article":"Tramp & Modify\r\n"If Palestinians or, more broadly, radical Muslims, are described as "barbaric" "savages" "backwards" its probably because... \r\nThey commit suicide bombing EVERY SINGLE DAY. \r\n[ you mean the Iraqi resistance? I'd do the same thing to foreign invaders]\r\nThey created that pillar of civilisation we all know and love... the Taleban \r\n[ actually the Taleban was created by the ISI or the CIA:]\r\nThey routinely saw the heads off of people. \r\n[ and we routinely kill them with WP. Parody, anyone?]\r\nThey routinely commit honor killings. \r\n[ you got me there. Just like fundamental christians bomb clinics- go figure]\r\nThey openly declare their love of death.\r\n[ you are going to back this up with something?] \r\n\r\n","author":"Bruce","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 19:38:25","modified":"2005-12-31 19:38:25","fileurl":""},{"id":142922,"heading":"Bruce - fuckwit extraordinaire","article":"Just when you think you've seen all the stupid ones, yet another crawls out of the sewer.\r\n\r\nHow many clinics have been bombed, Brainiac? What's the ratio of right wing fanatics, as compared to islamofascists and their fellators?\r\n\r\nBetter yet, what's the ratio as compared to ALF and ELF and PETA, Brainiac?\r\n\r\nThe ISI or the CIA? You don't know, but are just throwing shit against the wall and hoping it sticks, ain't that right?\r\n\r\nLast but certainly not least, Brainiac asks if someone can back up the claim that Islamofascists openly declared their love of death. There are none so blind as those acne crippled Appeasers who have the groins of terrorists blocking their view.","author":"fuckwit detector","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 21:02:27","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142924,"heading":"CIA + Taleban","article":"Are you totally stupid?\r\nOr just a foul mouth behind a keyboard?\r\nI put my money on both.\r\nOne thing is for sure, you can't use a search engine.\r\nEnter\r\nCIA + Taleban.\r\nYou can do that.\r\nOr you can act like a "fuckwit". Could be it's not any act.\r\n","author":"Bruce","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 21:14:16","modified":"2005-12-31 21:14:16","fileurl":""},{"id":142928,"heading":"totally stupid?","article":"You're asking someone else if they're totally stupid? \r\n\r\nYou, the intellectual Vesuvius that compared abortion clinic bombings with the Islamofascists, yet ignored ALF and ELF and PETA?\r\n\r\nWhy is that, Brainiac? Why didn't you include hippie sewage terrorists in your little list of grievances? Surely it's not because unbathed terrorist fellatoes are intellectually dishonest fucks, right?","author":"Brainiac's bestest friend","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-12-31 21:50:04","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142930,"heading":"almost forgot","article":""They openly declare their love of death.\r\n[ you are going to back this up with something?] "\r\n\r\nThe burden is on you, Brainiac. They have publicly and consistently said such, and I defy you to back your assertion that they "love" life.\r\n\r\nWe're waiting, asswipe. Of course you have to get off your knees and wipe your chin first....","author":"Brainiac stomper","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/html","created":"2005-12-31 21:54:38","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142943,"heading":"skullfucking Brucie","article":"I'm going to continue asking you this question, Brainiac:\r\n\r\nWhy didn't you mention ALF and ELF and PETA when you wanted to be oh-so kewl in your adolescent retort? How many bombings have those terrorist groups done as compared to bombings of abortion clinics?\r\n\r\nWe're still waiting, Brainiac....","author":"Brainiac's bestest friend","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 00:50:47","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142945,"heading":"Israel vs. Palestine","article":"Israel is to Palestine as San Diego is to Tijuana.\r\n\r\nOn second thought, that's being unfair to Tijuana. Palestine is much worse than Tijuana. Israel is at least on par with San Diego and perhaps even nicer.\r\n\r\nWhy do you suppose Israel is such a well developed, clean, technologically sophisticated and successful country?\r\n\r\nAnd why do you suppose all of the Muslim countries surrounding Israel are such armpits?? \r\n\r\nThink about it doofus. Even you should be able to pick up on a clue like this.","author":"JonK","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 01:36:30","modified":"2006-01-01 01:36:30","fileurl":""},{"id":142946,"heading":"How SWEET","article":"WTF are you babbling about?\r\nI can imagine it's hard to go into the connections the CIA has to the Taleban but sheesh, you're not making any sense, not that I am surprised.\r\nThe reason America went to war in Iraq was that the "Israelis" in the form of the Neocon administration and all the dual citizenship members of this crew of assholes needed the oil for the Zionists in Israel. We aint getting any of it.\r\nWait till the Old Guard decides to rip out their guts. They don't like their capital devalued and are now disclosing more and more of the shit under your Zionist rug. Your time is running out. \r\n","author":"Bruce","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 01:47:08","modified":"2006-01-01 01:47:08","fileurl":""},{"id":142950,"heading":"While I'm at it","article":"Why *are* there so many dual citizen members in this current administration ?\r\nAfter "Israel" has BFed this country so many times.\r\n","author":"Bruce","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 02:14:38","modified":"2006-01-01 02:14:38","fileurl":""},{"id":142951,"heading":"okay, let's take it from the top","article":"Why didn't you mention ALF and ELF and PETA? How many bombings have those terrorist groups done as compared to bombings of abortion clinics?\r\n\r\nWe're still waiting, Brainiac....","author":"Brainiac's bestest friend","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 03:12:18","modified":"2006-01-01 03:13:54","fileurl":""},{"id":142952,"heading":"hole in the stomach","article":"I see that Mr. Palsied Scissorhands took your comment out, but it was a damn good one. ","author":"Brainiac's bestest friend","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 03:15:14","modified":"2006-01-01 03:15:14","fileurl":""},{"id":142964,"heading":"Just plain dumb","article":" They commit suicide bombing EVERY SINGLE DAY.\r\n[ you mean the Iraqi resistance? I'd do the same thing to foreign invaders]\r\n\r\n\r\nAND THAT WOULD MAKE YOU A SAVAGE...ESPECIALLY CONSIDERING VIRTUALLY EVERYONE OF YOUR VICTIMS ARE OTHER IRAQI CIVILIANS.\r\n\r\n\r\nThey created that pillar of civilisation we all know and love... the Taleban\r\n[ actually the Taleban was created by the ISI or the CIA:] \r\n\r\n\r\nUTTER NONSENSE. DO YOUR HOMEWORK. YOU CAN"T BLAME EVERY STONEAGE ISLAMIC DEVELOPMENT THAT OCCURED IN AFGANISTAN IN THE 80'S AND 90'S ON THE CIA'S SUPPORT OF THE MUHAJADEEN AGAINST THE SOVIETS. THAT'S A SIMPLISTIC AND EMBARASSINGLY STUPID ANALYSIS. IN FACT THE TALEBAN, DEVELOPED QUITE APART FROM THE MAIN FACTIONS FIGHTING THE SOVIETS.\r\n\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 07:24:33","modified":"2006-01-01 07:24:33","fileurl":""},{"id":142966,"heading":"Really?","article":"" I have an 1935 illuminated globe on which Palestine is clearly marked as a nation. "\r\n\r\nReally?\r\n\r\nSo what's the capital?\r\nWhat's their language? What form of government did they have? And their Monetary system? How about their constitution?\r\nWhat did their passports look like?\r\n\r\nI'm fascinated with this brand new state that you've discovered.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 07:31:02","modified":"2006-01-01 07:31:02","fileurl":""},{"id":142967,"heading":"Hey","article":"This was a land. And a people. Ask the Truks and the Brits","author":"Can do","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"image\/gif","created":"2006-01-01 07:51:27","modified":"2006-01-01 07:51:27","fileurl":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/12districtsmap.gif","image":{"original":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/12districtsmap.gif"}},{"id":142985,"heading":"Getting bored","article":"You've basically linked a map showing what was left of the region after TransJordan was finally founded in 1946.\r\n\r\nThat the word palestine was used to call this area of arab, Christian and Jewish land is not in dispute. That it was ever a distinquishable state, culture or society is.\r\n\r\nIt wasn't.\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 17:41:43","modified":"2006-01-01 17:41:43","fileurl":""},{"id":143003,"heading":"Got an idea for you","article":"Why doesn't fresca show us a map of Israel before say 1920\r\nIt simply wasn't there.","author":"Hey","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 19:52:22","modified":"2006-01-01 19:52:22","fileurl":""},{"id":143005,"heading":"here's the deal","article":"The zionists were allowed to settle into this former Ottoman state as long as they didn't imposed on the inhabitants that lived there after WWl.\r\nThat didn't last long. WWll gave the Zionist the rational for immigration after Eichmann made a deal with them. The rest were sacrificed into the death camps. For the Zionists.","author":"factor","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 20:00:55","modified":"2006-01-01 20:00:55","fileurl":""},{"id":143009,"heading":"Of course not","article":""Why doesn't fresca show us a map of Israel before say 1920\r\nIt simply wasn't there."\r\n\r\nRead your history. Israel became a state in '48.\r\n\r\nThe first ever state on that land.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 20:23:08","modified":"2006-01-01 20:23:08","fileurl":""},{"id":143018,"heading":"The Big Lie","article":""The first ever state on that land."\r\nSplitting hairs and rewriting the history when not outright destroying it is a serious endeavor.\r\nWhat it comes down to is betrayal and massacre of the people who are now\r\ntreated like mad dogs rather than humans. The rhetoric that is used by 'fresca' and 'Tramp' and that other psychopath with a fellation fetish, show most of the visitors here to read the comments section, exactly how sick, evil and wretched the enemies of Palestine are. \r\nTheir ugly ideology.\r\nTheir murderous intent and the methods they use to twist the truth when they are compelled to use it. And then the final retreat into victimhood and self righteousness as they kill with impunity. ","author":"factor","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 21:39:22","modified":"2006-01-01 21:39:22","fileurl":""},{"id":143022,"heading":"[ actually the Taleban was created by the ISI or the CIA:]","article":"You want links you want quotes names dates and blood types?\r\nWhy not? Copy and paste this \r\nCIA +Taleban +ISI\r\n[ It's called a search engine] ------Not Google-------They Suck-------\r\n\r\n","author":"Filbert","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 22:00:52","modified":"2006-01-01 22:00:52","fileurl":""},{"id":143024,"heading":"Bullshit","article":"" What it comes down to is betrayal and massacre of the people who are now "\r\n\r\nFucking nonsense. Jews were moving into that area since the late 1800's. They BOUGHT alot of the land to begin with. \r\n\r\nWhen Israel was established in '48 "palestine" could have had it's own state. They chose not to and were immediately set upon by their own ARAB neighbors.\r\n\r\nThere has been no shortage of violence and massacres from the hands of these "palestinian" arabs either, by the way.\r\n\r\nTo paint the "palestinians" as some noble, oppressed and betrayed people is utter fucking nonsense.\r\n\r\nThey had centuries to evolve and create a civilized society in that area. Had they, Israel probably wouldn't exist now. But of course, as soon as Israel DID exist and flourish, all of a sudden these "palestinians" have this rich history and legacy that's being oppressed.\r\n\r\nBullshit.\r\n\r\n"palestinians" (sic) had their chance. They BLEW it.\r\n\r\nTime for them to melt back into the rest of the arab world where they came from.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-01 23:30:34","modified":"2006-01-01 23:30:34","fileurl":""},{"id":143025,"heading":"then during the *rebellion*","article":"In 1948 the Zionists began their systematic campaign of bloody terror against the population. Many thousands were slaughtered without provocation in the massacre of many entire villages. This is not the advancement of culture, this is just the same old conquest. This one is particularly grievous for both sides. The simple solution having been used for the last sixty years have only produced terror. Frecsa wants more of this solution.","author":"Slice o Life","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 00:03:16","modified":"2006-01-02 00:03:16","fileurl":""},{"id":143027,"heading":"Oh and BTW 'fresca'","article":"In the future be at least a fraction more truthful by not chopping up a sentence of mine to taylor it modified, and out off context, to suit your lie.\r\nYou don't want everyone to know, if they haven't already by now, just how immoral and mean and petty your kind are.\r\nAnd how much your words are worth.","author":"pay attention here","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 00:14:32","modified":"2006-01-02 00:14:32","fileurl":""},{"id":143034,"heading":"Stop whining","article":""In the future be at least a fraction more truthful by not chopping up a sentence of mine to taylor it modified, and out off context, to suit your lie.\r\nYou don't want everyone to know, if they haven't already by now, just how immoral and mean and petty your kind are. "\r\n\r\nOh please, I copied and pasted your quote as you typed it short of the last few words which change the context and meaning not one bit.\r\n\r\nYour point remained intact. That the "palestinians" are some oppressed innocent group of saints set upon by the evil Jews.\r\n\r\nYour type is a dime a dozen around here.\r\n\r\nYour only concern for any problem in the middle east is if it's the Jews causing it. You grant the arab\/muslim world carte blanche to continue to wage a racist, sexist and savage war against all Jews (as they put it) and against civilized society as a whole.\r\n\r\nYour abject racism is VERY transparent.\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 02:36:03","modified":"2006-01-02 02:36:03","fileurl":""},{"id":143035,"heading":"fresca like the concept","article":"Look. \r\nThe bottom line is that the side 'fresca' supports, believes ethnic terror and genocide is fine as long as the level of repression can provoke some retaliation to justify more repression and genocide. \r\nWhat ever it takes.\r\nBut don't look at the issue of who is doing and has done most of the killing.","author":"deplorable reasoning","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 02:53:00","modified":"2006-01-02 02:53:00","fileurl":""},{"id":143037,"heading":""show us a map"","article":"","author":"here's a map","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"image\/jpeg","created":"2006-01-02 03:38:53","modified":"2006-01-02 03:38:53","fileurl":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/palestine47.jpg","image":{"original":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/palestine47.jpg"}},{"id":143038,"heading":""show us a map"","article":"","author":"here's another map","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"image\/jpeg","created":"2006-01-02 03:40:01","modified":"2006-01-02 03:40:01","fileurl":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/bantustansenposter250.jpg","image":{"original":"\/usr\/local\/www-domains\/la.indymedia.org\/public\/uploads\/2005\/12\/bantustansenposter250.jpg"}},{"id":143049,"heading":"Exactly","article":""as long as the level of repression can provoke some retaliation to justify more repression and genocide. "\r\n\r\nPretty much a verbatim quote from the pages of the Hamas or Islamic Jihad or (name-your-favorite-islamic-militant-group) field manual.\r\n\r\nAs long as these "palestinian" terrorists continue to attack Israel with the backing of other "innocent palestinians" and neighboring "peace-loving" muslims, there will never be peace.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 09:19:38","modified":"2006-01-02 09:19:38","fileurl":""},{"id":143050,"heading":"this","article":">Pretty much a verbatim quote from the pages of the Hamas or Islamic Jihad or (name-your-favorite-islamic-militant-group) field manual. <\r\n\r\nWhere the hell do you pull this shit from? Your ass?","author":"look at IT","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 09:23:24","modified":"2006-01-02 09:23:24","fileurl":""},{"id":143060,"heading":"petty coat juction","article":"\r\n\r\n\r\n"Your only concern for any problem in the middle east is if it's the Jews causing it. "\r\n{Is it warm under the skirt of an entire religious sect? Nasty thing. \r\nYou are repetitious and with your naked hypocrisy showing. Why does the Zionist raw aggression and criminal extortion go on? It's because of the well oiled, very reactive propaganda box. The usual players are involved in a coordinated assault on truth. Always flashing the manufactured " seething hatred of 'jews" yawner. Your kind farts these little phrases as a matter of course to foul the line of truth. \r\n The very level of this interference highlights the concern for perception management.}\r\n\r\n"You grant the arab\/muslim world carte blanche to continue to wage a racist, sexist and savage war against all Jews (as they put it) and against civilized \r\nsociety as a whole."\r\n\r\nDon't again --yawn--- hide under that skit, nasty thing, Conflation is a specialty of your kind. As well as another of those obligatory little squealing pig phrases \r\n\r\n-"Against all Jews As they [you mean yourself, because You may want to back at least one or two of your swamp of lies up, with something other than total crap. You very job here is endangering people of the Jewish faith by providing the very fuel of real global genocide. *You're* one of the stokers of the coming furnace ] put it"-\r\n\r\nShallow stupid little tool.\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n","author":"conductor->","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 16:58:50","modified":"2006-01-02 16:58:50","fileurl":""},{"id":143076,"heading":"Too much","article":"I think the most entertaining thing about the far left is the lengths it will go to convince itself that it's silly views and values are important enough, or actually, not too inane too inane to warrant some actual official response from the real world.\r\n\r\nThat any and all posts supporting Israel or at least calling attention to the fact that the issue is a two-sided one with "palestine" having an equal part in the violence, is somehow an official Zionist act of propaganda shows how severely narrow and intolerant the leftist mind really is.\r\n\r\nThe left will, of course, continue to deny history and support the bad guys out of spite. It's what it does. \r\n\r\nThabnkfully, it does so very transparently, and as in this thread, rather amusingly.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 22:59:19","modified":"2006-01-02 22:59:19","fileurl":""},{"id":143077,"heading":"Israel is the reason America is at war","article":"Israel is the reason we have fresca here. Busy busy busy always with a very big bucket of thick white wash. Can't put it on with a brush -it needs a trowel.","author":"And","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-02 23:53:02","modified":"2006-01-02 23:53:02","fileurl":""},{"id":143090,"heading":"Look at it","article":"From 'fresca'\r\n\r\n"That any and all posts supporting Israel or at least calling attention to the fact that the issue is a two-sided one with "palestine" having an equal part in the violence, is somehow an official Zionist act of propaganda shows how severely narrow and intolerant the leftist mind really is."\r\n\r\n[ Why is Palestine in lower case and quotes while all references to the Zionist state of Israel in proper name capitals? This is because to attempt to reverse the reality of the fact that the Zionists are in occupation of Palestine not as you and the JDL want us to believe; the other way around, which is opposite of the truth. This is the single most defended lie. It needs to be.]\r\nThe rest of the section contains ad homenims which are to be expected from this team because they want to create an incommunicable atmosphere on this forum. That is way these unfounded personal attacks are their standard recourse. It's good to be reviled by this kind.] \r\n\r\n","author":"this is what I mean","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 04:10:40","modified":"2006-01-03 04:10:40","fileurl":""},{"id":143094,"heading":"Again","article":"The above is a perfect example of what I'm talking about.\r\n\r\nThis fool actually thinks that anyone attacking his inane views of the isareli "palestinine" conflict and his inherent racism and support of militant islam MUST be some sort of operative.\r\n\r\nThat's just plain schizophrenia.\r\n\r\nUh, you're not that important due and your views are fringe.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 07:14:28","modified":"2006-01-03 07:14:28","fileurl":""},{"id":143102,"heading":"And Israel in the Reason","article":"Israel is the reason for the campaign of deceit. Their crimes are unrelenting and ugly.\r\nThat is why the constant and well organized involvement of more than one operator working in the same propaganda framework.\r\nEmploying the same frayed and threadbare old standbys.\r\nIf we were so in the minority and so irrelevant there would not be this\r\nconcerted a defense of such "irrelevancies".\r\nAnd the idea of withdrawing the support from this criminal enterprise with its attendant misery and injustice would not resonate.\r\nTwisting circumstances and history around to make Palestine the myth and 'Israel' the substance is a full time job and takes effort .. Happy to serve your 'entertainment' pro bono, speaking only in certainty, for myself.","author":"word","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 16:14:24","modified":"2006-01-03 16:14:24","fileurl":""},{"id":143107,"heading":"franticly flapping flags","article":"Exactly as predicted, the same racist inferences without substance.\r\nThe familiar conflations. The same sloganeering. But with feeling.\r\nNever addressing a damn point. Please entertain *me*.\r\nCall in your entire crew. Me and 'you'.\r\n","author":"observer","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 17:09:35","modified":"2006-01-03 17:09:35","fileurl":""},{"id":143122,"heading":"Code speak","article":"" Never addressing a damn point. Please entertain *me*. \r\n\r\nAh! the time honored tradition of the left crying " Never addressing a damn point. Please entertain *me*. " as a coded response meaning that all their points have been refuted.\r\n\r\nIt is the left which steadfastedly ignores all salient points.\r\n\r\nLet's just see how the following points are addressed.\r\n\r\n\r\n1) GAza, GH and WB are all territories gained by Israel in '67 from Egypt, Syria and Jordan respectively. NOT some mythical state known as "palestine".\r\n\r\n2) When Jordan became a state on the VAST MAJORITY of the land coloquially known as Palestine in '47, the left had NO PROBLEM with that. Nor does it have any problem with the thousands of "palestinians" murdered by Jordan since.\r\n\r\n3) "palestinian" militant groups have, as their main driving philosophy, a desire to "kill Jews from the river to the sea" or "wherever they are found". The left seems to have no problem with this blanket hate speech.\r\n\r\n4) "Palestine" could have become a state in '48 but declined, at which point it's arab neighbors rushed in and grabbed much of it's land. NOT ISRAEL mind you , but Egypt, Syria and Transjordan.\r\n\r\nNow, I'm not holding my breath. I suspect I'll get more of the "he's clearly a Mossad Cointelpro plant" or some such other schizophrenic bullshit. Or maybe some plain old "Nuh Uh1 it's the Zionazis!".\r\n\r\nLet's see. This oughta be good.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 20:52:04","modified":"2006-01-03 20:52:04","fileurl":""},{"id":143136,"heading":"bust your buttons","article":"1) GAza, GH and WB are all territories gained by Israel in '67 from Egypt, Syria and Jordan respectively. NOT some mythical state known as "palestine". \r\n[ Ah the major Zionest lie and excuse. -'We conquered and or invaded it because we had most of the weapons and we get to keep it. -\r\n Maybe we should have let Nazi Germany keep France or Japan keep China. After all might makes right.\r\nThen there is the myth of 'Israel' which in 1948 was created in the propaganda mills of the world, by perception managers like 'fresca' and team, to obliterate any idea of a native population living there for millennia before the 'state' of 'Israel' ever was conceived Before the terrorist invasion by heavily armed conquistadors or crusaders bent on buying where permitted and swindling, murdering or terrorizing where resistance occurred to the appropriations of their land. All to foster the myth of an 'Israeli' nation instead of the land of the original people, known through out the world as Palestine.\r\nNow the recipients of determined 'ethnic cleansing' which is a cruel euphemism for murder, humiliation, degradation, torture and murder on a daily basis. \r\nInhuman treatment by a loudly self professed democracy and 'evolved' society. Zionists rely on massive disinformation and short term historical memory as well as a here to fore compliant media to maintain this lie.\r\nTo the residents who were there before 'Israel' came into being, no matter the intense difraction into particulars, it is a death camp with Israeli razor wire and guard posts.] \r\n\r\n\r\n2) When Jordan became a state on the VAST MAJORITY of the land coloquially known as Palestine in '47, the left had NO PROBLEM with that. Nor does it have any problem with the thousands of "palestinians" murdered by Jordan since. \r\n\r\n["The left had NO PROBLEM with that" How wonderful. Someone who can read the collective mind of 'the left' with such omega like infallibility.\r\nA fool is the most correct creature anyone could ever meet. Just ask them.\r\nThat's if the above quote meant anything but sloganism anyway. 'The "left" ' - don't make me laugh. You're running on MT.\r\n\r\n3) "palestinian" militant groups have, as their main driving philosophy, a desire to "kill Jews from the river to the sea" or "wherever they are found". The left seems to have no problem with this blanket hate speech. \r\n\r\n\r\n[ and the way you have been advocating death to Muslims for years is what... just kidding? Nasty hypocrite.\r\nYour objection is to the fact that they wont just lay down while the tanks roll over them. To give up their lives which have been transformed into a living hell.]\r\n\r\n4) "Palestine" could have become a state in '48 but declined, at which point it's arab neighbors rushed in and grabbed much of it's land. NOT ISRAEL mind you , but Egypt, Syria and Transjordan. \r\n\r\n[ "Israel "could have dealt fairly and ethically with the existing population and immigrated peacefully even if that meant respecting the indigenous culture and people. . And you're confusing immigration and migration after the Turks were pushed out with Zionist armed and bloody seizure.\r\nYou're still MT ]","author":"buy this","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 22:31:54","modified":"2006-01-03 22:31:54","fileurl":""},{"id":143141,"heading":"Textbook!","article":""1) GAza, GH and WB are all territories gained by Israel in '67 from Egypt, Syria and Jordan respectively. NOT some mythical state known as "palestine".\r\n[ Ah the major Zionest lie and excuse. -'We conquered and or invaded it because we had most of the weapons and we get to keep it. -\r\nMaybe we should have let Nazi Germany keep France or Japan keep China. After all might makes right.\r\nThen there is the myth of 'Israel' which in 1948 was created in the propaganda mills of the world, by perception managers like 'fresca' and team, to obliterate any idea of a native population living there for millennia before the 'state' of 'Israel' ever was conceived Before the terrorist invasion by heavily armed conquistadors or crusaders bent on buying where permitted and swindling, murdering or terrorizing where resistance occurred to the appropriations of their land. All to foster the myth of an 'Israeli' nation instead of the land of the original people, known through out the world as Palestine.\r\nNow the recipients of determined 'ethnic cleansing' which is a cruel euphemism for murder, humiliation, degradation, torture and murder on a daily basis.\r\nInhuman treatment by a loudly self professed democracy and 'evolved' society. Zionists rely on massive disinformation and short term historical memory as well as a here to fore compliant media to maintain this lie.\r\nTo the residents who were there before 'Israel' came into being, no matter the intense difraction into particulars, it is a death camp with Israeli razor wire and guard posts.]\r\n\r\n\r\nEXCEPT THAT NAZI GERMANY WERE THE AGGRESSORS. ISRAEL WAS invaded BY ITS ARAB NEIGHBORS IN 67. tHE LAND IS CLEARLY iSAREL'S. OR DO YOU PROPOSE GING THE LAND BACK TO EGYPT, SYRIA AND JORDAN? DO YOU THINK THEY MIGHT GIFT THIS LAND TO THE "PALESTINIANS"?\r\n\r\n\r\n2) When Jordan became a state on the VAST MAJORITY of the land coloquially known as Palestine in '47, the left had NO PROBLEM with that. Nor does it have any problem with the thousands of "palestinians" murdered by Jordan since.\r\n\r\n["The left had NO PROBLEM with that" How wonderful. Someone who can read the collective mind of 'the left' with such omega like infallibility.\r\nA fool is the most correct creature anyone could ever meet. Just ask them.\r\nThat's if the above quote meant anything but sloganism anyway. 'The "left" ' - don't make me laugh. You're running on MT.\r\n\r\nOF COURSE I DO. ANYONE WHO CAN READ CAN GET A CONSENSUS OF A PARTICULAR SUBCULTURES COLLECTIVE OPINION ON A SUBJECT. I'VE BEEN READING INDYMEDIA FOR YEARS AND I'VE NEVER SEEN A WORD REGARDING JORDAN'S TREATMENT OF THESE PARTICULAR ARABS. SO YEAH, I DO KNOW.\r\n\r\n3) "palestinian" militant groups have, as their main driving philosophy, a desire to "kill Jews from the river to the sea" or "wherever they are found". The left seems to have no problem with this blanket hate speech.\r\n\r\n\r\n[ and the way you have been advocating death to Muslims for years is what... just kidding? Nasty hypocrite.\r\nYour objection is to the fact that they wont just lay down while the tanks roll over them. To give up their lives which have been transformed into a living hell.]\r\n\r\nNO, MY OBJECTION IS TO THESE SUBHUMANS LIKE HAMAS WHOSE ATROCITIES PROMOTE AND ARE DESIGNED TO PROVOKE ISRAELI RETALIATION. DO YOU EXPECT ISAREL TO SIMPLY LAY DOWN THEIR ARMS AND BE ANNIHILATED? AND WHILE I CERTAINLY CAN SEE ISLAM FOR THE BACKWARDS CULT THAT IT IS, THE ONLY FOLLOWERS I WANT DEAD ARE THE ISLAMISTS. AND QUICKLY PLEASE.\r\n\r\n\r\n4) "Palestine" could have become a state in '48 but declined, at which point it's arab neighbors rushed in and grabbed much of it's land. NOT ISRAEL mind you , but Egypt, Syria and Transjordan.\r\n\r\n[ "Israel "could have dealt fairly and ethically with the existing population and immigrated peacefully even if that meant respecting the indigenous culture and people. . And you're confusing immigration and migration after the Turks were pushed out with Zionist armed and bloody seizure.\r\nYou're still MT ]\r\n\r\nI DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE RESPONDING TO HERE BUT THE POINT REMAINS THAT "PALESTINE" CHOSE AGAINST STATEHOOD IN '48 AND WAS OVERRUN BY IT'S ARAB NEIGHBORS. NOT ISRAEL. AND BY THE WAY, THE TURKS WERE GONE BEFORE '48.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 22:56:37","modified":"2006-01-03 22:56:37","fileurl":""},{"id":143152,"heading":"Shouting and Screaming now.","article":"Oh -resorting to cap lock. \r\n\r\nI'm glad to have elicited such a reaction.Create your own version of history if you want. Make sure to repeat loudly and often.\r\nStill it cannot hide the smell of death from its actions. And still you are a silly short sighted tool. Any backlash resulting from the reality of this genocide will be yours to take credit for. You wont be alone if that's any consolation.","author":"soon to be jumping up and down","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-03 23:27:52","modified":"2006-01-03 23:27:52","fileurl":""},{"id":143156,"heading":"Ho hum","article":""Oh -resorting to cap lock.\r\n\r\nI'm glad to have elicited such a reaction."\r\n\r\nThe caps were used to differentiate my refutations of your lame obfuscations from your typing.\r\n\r\nClearly.\r\n\r\nBy the way, regardless of what side you're on, calling ANYTHING having to do with the situation "genocide" is just silly hyperbole.\r\n\r\nMy points still stand, unchallenged.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 00:44:20","modified":"2006-01-04 00:44:20","fileurl":""},{"id":143160,"heading":"overtime now","article":"In the Genocide Convention of 1948, the word genocide was defined loosely, as any act "committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group as such." Genocidal acts included causing serious "mental harm" or inflicting "conditions of life" aimed at such destruction.\r\n\r\n","author":"read this","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 01:09:37","modified":"2006-01-04 01:09:37","fileurl":""},{"id":143169,"heading":"Hmmm?","article":""In the Genocide Convention of 1948, the word genocide was defined loosely, as any act "committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group as such.""\r\n\r\nSounds sorta like what hamas et.al have always said they've wanted to do to the Jews.\r\n\r\nThanks for clearing that up.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 04:12:27","modified":"2006-01-04 04:12:27","fileurl":""},{"id":143171,"heading":"why?","article":">Sounds sorta like what hamas et.al have always said they've wanted to do to the Jews.<\r\nThat would be after the massacres of the Zionist invasion gave them new insights into the spirit of their new neighbors. Jews were living with Muslims as well as Christians, in relative peace for thousands of years. Don't bring them into your corner to hide behind. There are many Jewish people who are working for justice who would be offended to be called Zionists. Particularly when they are aware of the world beyond your seething hatred for Muslims and Islam.","author":"on the other hand","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 04:33:01","modified":"2006-01-04 04:33:01","fileurl":""},{"id":143190,"heading":"Where's the Israeli Army?","article":"If "Israel is the reason", then where the hell is the Israeli military in Iraq?","author":"johnk","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 09:51:23","modified":"2006-01-04 09:51:23","fileurl":""},{"id":143197,"heading":"The IDF","article":"That's easy, they're busy killing civilians in occupied Palestine.\r\nUnfortunately, they are also getting ready to start WW4 with Iran, Syria and Egypt..\r\nThat's why they need their proxies to do the heavy lifting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan.\r\nIsrael needs the oil and the pipelines.","author":"Where do you think they are?","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 17:19:11","modified":"2006-01-04 17:19:11","fileurl":""},{"id":143200,"heading":""Sounds sorta like what hamas et.al have always said they've wanted to do to the Jews","article":"If \u201cthey do it, too\u201d were a valid excuse, Hitler would be off the hook for killing those six million Jews, because Stalin killed six million Ukrainians. ","author":"heard it before","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-04 17:59:25","modified":"2013-11-11 00:37:21","fileurl":""},{"id":143212,"heading":"You're correct","article":""If \u201cthey do it, too\u201d were a valid excuse,"\r\n\r\nYou're right. It's not.\r\n\r\nIt's ONLY hamas et.al who operate under such racist and genocidal guidelines.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 01:07:59","modified":"2013-11-11 00:37:21","fileurl":""},{"id":143213,"heading":"and why is that?","article":"That's because 'Israel' can never do any wrong. Genocide, when done by 'Israel', is always for the good. \r\n Just ask the JDL or 'fresca.'","author":"Stubbs","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 01:14:18","modified":"2006-01-05 01:14:18","fileurl":""},{"id":143218,"heading":"No","article":"It's simply because it's not genocide for Israel to defend itself against a horde of savages who loudly and proudly proclaim their wish to kill "every Jew wherever they may be found".\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 03:03:19","modified":"2006-01-05 03:03:19","fileurl":""},{"id":143220,"heading":"mirror time","article":"And the Palestinians can say:\r\n\r\n"It's simply because it's not genocide for Palestine to defend itself against a horde of savages who loudly and proudly proclaim their wish to kill "every Palestinian wherever they may be found". \r\n\r\nJust like 'fresca'.\r\n","author":"look @ you","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 03:55:20","modified":"2006-01-05 03:55:20","fileurl":""},{"id":143221,"heading":"Wrong","article":"But Israel doesn't say this. Israel doesn't have, as part of it's fucking mission statement the desire to kill all arabs. Only certain "palestinian" groups , with seemingly full support of the populace have declared the same against all Jews, not even just Israeli's but ALL JEWS.\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 05:18:16","modified":"2006-01-05 05:18:16","fileurl":""},{"id":143277,"heading":"-But Israel doesn't say this-","article":"They have spokesmen like 'fresca' who are there to try and contain the truth which is Israel's determination to extinguish the Palestinian culture and people. As they loudly and constantly proclaim that there never were any people there and while they earnestly strive to make this a reality. \r\nYou have yourself stated numerous times the wish to wipe out ALL Muslims.\r\n\r\nAnd this is no difference from the radical 'solution' offered from any racist agenda. ","author":"of course not","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-05 15:44:03","modified":"2006-01-05 15:44:03","fileurl":""},{"id":143329,"heading":"LOL!","article":"Keep repeating the same nonsense over and over again and hope it sticks.\r\n\r\n"Israel's determination to extinguish the Palestinian culture and people."\r\n\r\nThere simply is NO "palestinian" culture or people.\r\n\r\nNone. There never has been. Period.\r\n\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-06 00:26:29","modified":"2006-01-06 00:26:29","fileurl":""},{"id":143343,"heading":"And this is why","article":"And with that kind of attitude it is little wonder that bombs do go off in crowded 'israel' busses, killing 'israelis'. They simply don't exist.\r\nJust testing.","author":"citizen","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-06 02:07:44","modified":"2006-01-06 02:07:44","fileurl":""},{"id":143347,"heading":"Well","article":""And with that kind of attitude it is little wonder that bombs do go off in crowded 'israel' busses, killing 'israelis'. They simply don't exist."\r\n\r\nWell, I'm not surprised that you've found yet another justification for killing Jews but please allow me to point out something.\r\n\r\nIsrael , unlike "palestine" or "narnia" or "middle earth" does in fact exist. It has a government, a culture, it's own language. It has borders. It's recognized on maps. \r\n\r\nNone of which can be said for the other exciting yet mythical places mentioned above.\r\n\r\n","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-06 02:19:17","modified":"2006-01-06 02:19:17","fileurl":""},{"id":143350,"heading":"I'm not surprised","article":"I didn't expect you to be.\r\nSo stop wanking when these mythical people kill.\r\nThe solution would be to let 'israel' fend for itself without that 5 Billion a year\r\nto buy and grease the guns and tanks they require to murder a people you say doesn't exist.\r\nNo wonder you are choking in blood.","author":"and so it goes","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-06 02:48:01","modified":"2006-01-06 02:48:01","fileurl":""},{"id":143356,"heading":"Oh no","article":"" So stop wanking when these mythical people kill.\r\nThe solution would be to let 'israel' fend for itself without that 5 Billion a year "\r\n\r\nOh they exist all right. But "palestinian" is a mere contrivance. They are simply arabs bent on killing Jews. Adjecent Jew-Haters as they've so succinctly been dubbed.\r\n\r\nAnd 5 billion (it's actually around 3 billion but 5 would be better) dollars is a small price to pay to help support and defend the only bastion of civilization in the entire middle east.\r\n\r\nI mean, at least we must agree on that right? Even you must admit that the arab world is a de-evolved, savage miasma of hate, violence and barbarism.\r\n\r\nThere's simply no refuting that. There are countless examples and evidence of this, literally daily.","author":"fresca","parent_id":142640,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2006-01-06 03:32:23","modified":"2006-01-06 03:32:23","fileurl":""}]}