Religion is Religion, Communism is Scientific\r\n<\/p>
But what I want to focus on here—because it is a very important point of\r\ndistortion which not only characterizes this letter but is much more broadly\r\npromoted, particularly by religious fundamentalists, and is the source of\r\nconsiderable confusion and misunderstanding—is the insistence that communism\r\n(and atheism generally) is actually just another form of religion and that in\r\nfact not only communism but all scientific thinking involves just as much a\r\n\"leap of faith\" as does religion. In this article, I will discuss how\r\nthis is completely wrong and will examine the crucial differences between\r\nreligion and \"leaps of faith,\" on the one hand, and science and the\r\nscientific method—including communism, with its thorough, systematic and\r\ncomprehensive scientific outlook and method—on the other hand.<\/p>\r\n
This claim that communism (and more generally a scientific outlook and\r\nmethod) is just another form of religion is concentrated in the following from\r\nthis letter:<\/p>\r\n
\"I hope you’re not offended that I call your atheism faith. I’m sure\r\nyou realize atheism is a faith system too. And since you’ve pinned you’re\r\n[sic] hope on its truthfulness, we can call it your religion. How about that!?\r\nBob Avakian is a religious man!<\/p>\r\n
\"You probably realize what most evolutionists don’t since no one was\r\nthere to record the Big Bang, it too is just as much a leap of faith as the\r\nbiblical version of creation. But no worries, you can always make your case\r\nstronger by stating forcefully, ’Evolution is a fact!’ \"<\/p>\r\n
The heart of the matter here—and what is fundamentally wrong in the\r\nviewpoint of the writer of this letter—is the attempt to distort what is\r\ninvolved in the application of a scientific method and approach, in the process\r\nof scientific investigation and analysis and in the drawing of scientifically\r\nbased conclusions. More specifically, what is fundamentally wrong is the attempt\r\nto say that the actual leaps that are involved in arriving at rational\r\nknowledge of things<\/em> —including through the application of the scientific\r\nmethod—somehow amount to the same thing<\/em> as \"leaps of faith\"\r\nthat are characteristic of religion. In fact, these are profoundly and radically\r\ndifferent kinds<\/em> of \"leaps,\" and digging into the difference\r\nwill not only further expose the confusion and outright distortions and\r\nmisrepresentations in this letter, and in the method of thinking of its author,\r\nbut much more importantly can help clarify the fundamental difference between a\r\nscientific and a religious approach to reality and to changing—or not\r\nchanging—reality, including human society.<\/p>\r\n Read the whole article at http:\/\/rwor.org\/a\/010\/avakian-leap-faith-leap-rationale.htm\r\n<\/p>\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\n","contact":".","link":"http:\/\/revcom.us","address":".","phone":".","parent_id":0,"mime_type":"image\/jpeg","summary":"A Leap of Faith and a Leap to Rational Knowledge:\r\nTwo Very Different Kinds of Leaps,\r\nTwo Radically Different Worldviews and Methods\r\n\r\nThis article was written by Bob Avakian, Chairman of the Revolutionary Communist Party, in response to a letter that sent to him. \r\n\r\nIn addition to attacking communism, that letter also argued against the scientific viewpoint and method and insisted that atheism is just another form of religion. \r\n\r\nThis article by Chairman Avakian speaks to a number of points in that letter but focuses on the fundamental difference between a communist and scientific outlook and method on the one hand and, on the other hand, a religious worldview which relies on "leaps of faith."","numcomment":3,"fileurl":"\/uploads\/2005\/07\/rwpic.jpg","filesize":"138.3 kibibytes","article_url":"\/news\/2005\/07\/133801.php","image":{"original":"\/uploads\/2005\/07\/rwpic.jpg","small":"\/uploads\/2005\/07\/rwpic.jpgthumb.jpg","medium":"\/uploads\/2005\/07\/rwpic.jpgmid.jpg"}},"attachments":[],"comments":[{"id":133806,"heading":"leaps of faith and science v logic","article":"For a person who doesn't understand or apply scientific method accepting scientific conclusions IS a matter of faith.\r\n\r\nEvolution is established by fossil record, carbon 14 and other radiodating establishes timespan way beyond what most religious faith deals with, and more recently, DNA typing establishes evolution as well.\r\n\r\n(I say most because not all religions are at odds with scientific method or discovery and a few have timescales even beyond what science considers)\r\n\r\nIt takes tremendous leaps of faith to NOT acknowledge these facts\r\n\r\nBut faith is all some people have..\r\n\r\n\r\nRe: communism being scientific\r\n\r\nWhile not religious I don't consider a culture or social order to be necessarily scientific either as people who compromise it don't necessarily practice scientific method - whomever uses scientific method is scientific - but it's at best a generalization to classify millions of people each different as doing so.\r\n\r\nTo me science is removed from social and cultural aspects and stands apart as simply a method that any class of people can use no matter what thier political alignment might be\r\n\r\nCommunism is a political system - science is individuals practicing scientific method whereas political systems by definition encompass many people, some of who don't necessarily practice scientific method \r\n\r\nA community of scientists could be said to be a politically scientific society, but millions of ordinary people within a political system, even if the system it'self uses scientific principles doesn't make non-scientific method people scientists and science is strictly an individual and personal thing.\r\n\r\nOnly people can be scientific or be called scientists - machines have only logic, and systems are merely an extension of machines (non-personal, non-individual, non-human)\r\n\r\nSo at best communism can only be claimed to be LOGICAL\r\n\r\nScientific and science are values reserved for people as only people can practice science, not machines or systems..\r\n\r\n","author":"Hex","parent_id":133801,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-07-31 09:11:42","modified":"2005-07-31 09:11:42","fileurl":""},{"id":133808,"heading":"blinded me with science","article":"A fellow technocrat! Save me from chaos and these infinite fractiles beyond sanity going on and on and on.","author":"Hecks","parent_id":133801,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-07-31 10:07:44","modified":"2005-07-31 10:07:44","fileurl":""},{"id":133843,"heading":"chaos is your friend","article":"um - fractals\r\n\r\nI don't consider myself to be a technocrat - technology is incidental to my interests which involve non-technical issues such as spirituality and nature.\r\n\r\nTo me technocrat implies love of technology for it's own sake.\r\n\r\nI was known as "the mad scientist" as a kid so you could say I'm a scientist to the core or that science is my life's calling - I didn't become spiritual until 17 when I found a religion that meshes with science (specifically particle and astrophysics which are some of my fields of interest)\r\n","author":"Hex","parent_id":133801,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-07-31 12:21:16","modified":"2005-07-31 12:21:16","fileurl":""}]}