{"article":{"id":95958,"heading":"Excellent News - More dead scumbags","author":"fresca7876","created":"2003-12-02 02:10:19","modified":"2013-11-11 00:27:47","last_modified":"Mon, 11 Nov 2013 07:27:47","article":"

U.S. Forces Kill 46 Iraqis Attempting Ambush



Sunday, November 30, 2003



SAMARRA, Iraq — American forces fended off an attempted ambush Sunday, killing at least 46 Iraqis and capturing eight others in the northern city of Samarra (search). At least five U.S. soldiers, 22 Iraqi attackers and a civilian were injured.



American troops were fighting off tightly coordinated, simultaneous attacks in the northern Iraq, the U.S. military said.

Many of the dead Iraqi attackers were found wearing uniforms of the Fedayeen (search), a militia loyal to Saddam Hussein, according to Lt. Col. William MacDonald of the 4th Infantry Division (search).

A coalition source told Fox News that one of the U.S. convoys that came under attack was transporting a significant amount of money.

An Iraqi Currency Exchange (ICE) party with \"a very significant amount\" of new, non-Saddam Iraqi dinar notes was being escorted by a U.S. military unit of 100, with M1A1 tanks and Bradley armored vehicles. Apache attack helicopters were also called.

\"It was a well-organized and complex ambush, but they obviously picked the wrong convoy to attack. They could not have known,\" the source told Fox News.

The source confirmed that at least 46 Iraqi fighters were killed, 22 were wounded and eight were captured but said the toll could rise.

\"Enemy casualties may be larger,\" the source told Fox News. \"We will only know in the morning when we have a chance to survey the battleground in daylight.\"

MacDonald described the attack as massive and well coordinated.

\"This is the largest one for our task force since we've been in theater,\" he said. \"The 4th Infantry Division repelled multiple ambush attacks.\"

Mortar fire, grenades and small arms fire were used against the Americans, but there were no U.S. deaths reported. Three buildings were destroyed by the Americans during the firefight.

\"It sounds like the attack had some coordination to it, but the soldiers responded, used their firepower, used tank and Bradley fire and other weapons available to them, to stop this attack and take the fight to the enemy,\" MacDonald said.

Two U.S. supply convoys were moving into Samarra when they were attacked with roadside bombs, small arms fire, mortars and rocket-propelled grenades. The attacks — one on the east side of the city, the other on the west — were simultaneous and appeared to be coordinated, he said.

After setting up a barricade along the route of one of the convoys, the attackers opened fire from rooftops and alleyways, according to MacDonald.

He said U.S. soldiers returned fire from several locations at each ambush, using small arms, 120mm tank rounds and 25mm canon fire from Bradley fighting vehicles. The U.S. fire destroyed three buildings the attackers were using, he said.

MacDonald said he didn't think convoy procedures needed to be altered as a result of the attack, because his troops won the battles.

\"We have been very aggressive in our convoy operations to ensure the maximum force protection is with each convoy,\" he said. \"But it does send a clear message that if you attempt to attack one of our convoys, we're going to use our firepower to stop that attack.\"

In a separate attack about an hour later, another convoy of U.S. military engineers was attacked by four men with automatic rifles. The soldiers returned fire, wounding all four men, MacDonald said. He said soldiers found Kalashnikov rifles and grenade launchers in their car, a black BMW.

None of the wounded Americans suffered life-threatening injuries, MacDonald said. Two sustained only minor injuries, while the other three were evacuated, along with the wounded civilian.

Samarra is 60 miles north of Baghdad in the so-called Sunni Triangle where opposition to the U.S. occupation of Iraq has been fiercest.

The news came just after another round of violence targeted the coalition in Iraq over the weekend.

Gun-toting guerrillas shot and killed two South Korean electricians and wounded two others Sunday as they drove toward a work site in Tikrit (search).

MacDonald said the attempted ambush of U.S. troops in Samarra was unrelated to the attack on South Koreans.

A day earlier, two American soldiers were killed and one injured when guerrillas ambushed them with rocket-propelled grenades; a Colombian civilian contractor for the U.S. military was killed in an ambush; and seven Spanish intelligence agents and two Japanese diplomats died in separate attacks near Baghdad (search ).

\"They clearly are targeting coalition members in an effort to intimidate all allies in Iraq and discourage their participation in the reconstruction of Iraq,\" said Dan Senor, a spokesman for the top U.S. official in Iraq, L. Paul Bremer. \"They recognize that the stakes are high for us and we realize the stakes are high too.\"

November was the bloodiest month for coalition forces since the start of combat March 20.

The latest deaths bring to 104 the number of coalition soldiers who have died in Iraq in November, with 79 American soldiers slain and 25 other allied soldiers.

The attacks on U.S. allies appear to be part of an effort to undercut the coalition. Guerrillas also have targeted Iraqis seen as collaborating with the occupation authorities, such as police and local officials.

The South Koreans were killed by gunmen Sunday as they rode in a passenger car, apparently to a power transmission plant they were working at in Tikrit, South Korea's foreign ministry said Sunday. The workers' company was hired by a U.S. firm to lay power lines.

South Korean Deputy Foreign Minister Lee Soo-hyuck told reporters early Monday that he wasn't sure whether the killings would affect South Korea's participation in the restructuring of Iraq.

\"It is too early to comment,\" Lee said. \"We must take time to analyze things.\"

The two American soldiers were killed Saturday when fighters unleashed rocket-propelled grenades and automatic fire on a task force from the 3rd Armored Cavalry Regiment (search), a statement from the U.S. military said Sunday.

A third American was wounded in the attack, which happened just east of Husaybah and 180 miles northwest of Baghdad.

The Spanish military intelligence officers were also ambushed on Saturday in Mahmudiyah, 18 miles south of Baghdad. Seven were killed and one escaped the assault.

On Sunday, witnesses at the scene of the ambush about 30 miles south of Baghdad, said the Spaniards had been traveling in two sport utility vehicles when men in a car behind them opened fire. One of the SUVs careened off the road into a ditch.

The occupants fled the SUV and were shot at the roadside, perhaps by a second group of attackers. On Sunday, the charred remains of the vehicle could be seen in a watery ditch at the side of the road, with villagers scavenging its parts.

Witnesses said the four men in the second SUV were also killed at the side of the road nearby, apparently by a grenade. Blood could be seen on bushes nearby, and a broken pair of glasses lay in the road.

Spanish defense minister Federico Trillo arrived in Kuwait Sunday to repatriate the bodies, which were flown to Kuwait's International Airport aboard a C-130 Hercules transport, officials in Madrid just said.

Spokesmen for Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar said the attack wouldn't cause Spain to end its presence in Iraq. Spain was one of the firmest supporters of the U.S.-led invasion to oust Saddam Hussein and sent 1,300 soldiers to help maintain order.

A Spanish diplomat attached to Spain's intelligence agency was assassinated near his residence in Baghdad on Oct. 9, and a Spanish navy captain was killed in the truck bombing of the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad on Aug. 19.

The two Japanese diplomats were killed by unidentified gunmen Saturday as they stopped to buy food and drinks at a stand outside the village of Mukayshifa on the road between Baghdad and Tikrit, Lt. Col. William MacDonald said Sunday.

The diplomats, on their way to attend a reconstruction conference, were not traveling with a military escort, MacDonald said. Their Iraqi driver was also reported killed in the incident.

In Tokyo, Japanese Foreign Minister Yoriko Kawaguchi said there would be no change to Japan's plans to dispatch troops to support the U.S.-led reconstruction of Iraq. The deaths were the first of Japanese in Iraq since the U.S.-led invasion.

In Baghdad, Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt said the attacks there showed the enemy was switching the focus of the violence from coalition troops to what he described as \"soft targets, Iraqi targets, rather than military targets.\"

\"It's an easier way for the enemy to achieve what he wants to achieve,\" he said. \"We've said for several weeks that this is a clever, adaptive enemy.\"

Also Sunday, the U.S. military for the first time acknowledged that the single deadliest incident of the war — the collision of two Black Hawk helicopters in Mosul on Nov. 15 — may have been caused by enemy action. Until now, the military had not speculated publicly on the cause of the collision in which 17 soldiers died.

\"It appears to be that one helicopter was hit by a (rocket-propelled grenade),\" said Col. Joe Anderson, commander of the 2nd Brigade of the 101st Airborne Division. \"This is all still under investigation but it appears that there was some form of ground fire, probably an RPG that hit one which caused one to collide.\"

Fox News' Steve Centanni and The Associated Press contributed to this report.



<\/p>\n","contact":"","link":"","address":"","phone":"","parent_id":0,"mime_type":"text\/plain","summary":"U.S. Forces Kill 46 Iraqis Attempting Ambush ","numcomment":23,"fileurl":"\/uploads\/","filesize":null,"article_url":"\/news\/2003\/12\/95958.php"},"attachments":[],"comments":[{"id":95960,"heading":"That's what I'm talkin' 'bout.","article":"Mess with the best ... die like the rest.","author":"Max","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 02:35:36","modified":"2003-12-02 02:35:36","fileurl":""},{"id":95962,"heading":"Yeah really ...","article":"...how dare those scummy Iraqi's dare to defend their Country against a foreign invasion force, an arrogant occupying Army of Mercenaries Operating for the Bush Fambly. \r\n\r\nHow dare they think that they should have the right to attack a foreign Occupying Power that stand in defiance of the Geneva Accords, The Geneva Convention, and the U.N. Charter. You would think that they are crazy enough to believe that the U.S. Elite didn't have their fingers crossed when they signed them.\r\n\r\nAttaboy Max you tell them. Now go kill some Children. Ooohrah!","author":"Nonasskisser","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 02:50:54","modified":"2003-12-02 02:50:54","fileurl":""},{"id":95964,"heading":"^","article":"Oooo boy. Nothing like defending the hometurf of Indymedia, isn't it?\r\n\r\nGet a life!","author":"lk","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 02:57:44","modified":"2003-12-02 02:57:44","fileurl":""},{"id":95965,"heading":"scumbags","article":"And yes, any Iraqi's who do not welcome democracy and self-rule and would rather return to the days of Saddam Hussein are scumbags and should be shot. Don't like hearing that? I don't fucking care!!","author":"l;kdfjg","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 02:59:53","modified":"2003-12-02 02:59:53","fileurl":""},{"id":95966,"heading":"scumbags","article":"And yes, any Iraqi's who do not welcome democracy and self-rule and would rather return to the days of Saddam Hussein are scumbags and should be shot. Don't like hearing that? I don't fucking care!!","author":"l;kdfjg","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 03:02:19","modified":"2003-12-02 03:02:19","fileurl":""},{"id":95973,"heading":"INVADING SCUMBAGS","article":"Wow... big boys with big guns kill a bunch of Iraqis, and then pound their chests in macho bravado. Wow... you sure are heap big killers yankee boys. Very impressive with your cowboy vision and SUV sized Tanks (or is that Tank sized SUVs). Smash the Iraqis to bits you god fearing, video game playing, sports loving idiots. It's their country... but never mind that, it now belongs to EXXON... your rifles assure that. Democracy? Give us a break! DEMONocracy is more like it. Kill the women and children... and be home in time for Christmas you nazi bastards.","author":"leaving planet earth","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 03:48:04","modified":"2003-12-02 03:48:04","fileurl":""},{"id":95975,"heading":"What in the hell...","article":"What the hell could any of you asses possibly have against the simple idea that it is, of course, cause for celebration when OUR troops kill a bunch of Islamofascist savages.\r\n\r\nThis is a war against extreme Islam after all. There's absolutely no denying that. A war which was initiated by them. Why fault us for fighting back successfully?\r\n\r\nAnd as for the whole inane Exxon angle...who gives a fuck? To whatever extant that American companies profit from the death of these monsters...well that's just icing on the cake.\r\n\r\nLet's all just pray that these kills keep coming and growing.\r\n\r\nSyria next.","author":"fresca34d","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 04:12:38","modified":"2003-12-02 04:12:38","fileurl":""},{"id":95977,"heading":"WTF?!","article":"-A war which was initiated by them.-\r\nYou are insane. Dangerously insane. That's bad as it garnishes your stupidity and arrogance. Please die.","author":"Really","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 06:10:06","modified":"2003-12-02 06:10:06","fileurl":""},{"id":95982,"heading":"This is great news","article":"Saddam's scumbags came off the worst on this particular occasion. Well done to our brave, skillful professional troops.\r\n\r\nI sense this may be a turning point.\r\n\r\nYes, BTW, it's is a war which was started by Islamic extremists. Do you expect our government to just sit back and do nothing?\r\n\r\nThese scumbag Islamofascists want to end our civilisation.\r\n","author":"Barney","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 06:40:03","modified":"2003-12-02 06:40:03","fileurl":""},{"id":95985,"heading":"Ah yes body counts I remember them well.","article":"The way these body count reports work, in Iraq and Viet Nam, is that in a few days it will be "discovered" a number of the "attackers" killed were kids playing in there yards, some were civilians going about there business, the black "uniforms" mentioned in some reports were typical tribal clothing, etc. Also it will be found some Americans were killed.\r\nSame old trash from Fox.","author":"OzzyTeppics","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 08:18:19","modified":"2003-12-02 08:18:19","fileurl":""},{"id":95986,"heading":"FUCK YOU COMMIE !!","article":"GO LIVE IN NORTH KOREA, YOU LOUSY SHITBAG.\r\n\r\nHOPE YOU CATCH THE FAMINE.","author":"Bigfoot","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 08:55:49","modified":"2003-12-02 08:55:49","fileurl":""},{"id":95994,"heading":"Ozzy","article":"And if there are no such "discoveries" made, you will undoubtedly claim it's all a whitewash, won't you? \r\n\r\nOr are you simply disappointed the guerillas didn't get their way and slaughter American troops?","author":"nonanarchist0632","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 11:40:10","modified":"2003-12-02 11:40:10","fileurl":""},{"id":95999,"heading":"Absolutely","article":""-A war which was initiated by them.- \r\n\r\n\r\n\r\nWe didn't fly any planes into Mecca did we?","author":"fresca","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 12:26:21","modified":"2003-12-02 12:26:21","fileurl":""},{"id":96047,"heading":"OneEyedMan","article":"...you're a fuckin' idiot...\r\n\r\n...there's absolutely no denying that...\r\n\r\n...nope...no argument.","author":"KPC","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-02 23:01:27","modified":"2003-12-02 23:01:27","fileurl":""},{"id":96058,"heading":"Death Diminishes Us All","article":"Every death on our side is another excuse for us to attack them, and every death on their side is another excuse for them to attack us.\r\n\r\nEventually there won't be a reason to end the war. It's starting to feel like "1984".\r\n\r\nEvery dollar spent on war is a dollar I'm never going to see in from my clients, who are not military subcontractors.\r\n\r\nHey, fresca, nonanarchist, could you all just go to your local military subcontractor and get a job shoveling shit in Iraq, and leave this place in peace?","author":"more rational","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 00:14:03","modified":"2003-12-03 00:14:03","fileurl":""},{"id":96075,"heading":"Eyes rolling","article":""Death Diminishes Us All"\r\n\r\nWhat an embarrassing load of hippy nonsense.\r\n\r\nDid you actually come up with that tripe on your own or did you read it on some bumber sticker on the back of a Prius?\r\n\r\nSo, answer me this mister peace and love and profit) what is your solution to the lil' problem of islamic terrorism which is escalating globally. \r\n\r\nSeriously. Assuming my solution of finally fighting back is just plain wrong, what is your solution to finally end this utterly undeniable worldwide crisis.","author":"fresca-08m","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 02:57:30","modified":"2003-12-03 02:57:30","fileurl":""},{"id":96084,"heading":"NPR is on the SIDE OF THE ISLAMIC RESISTANCE","article":"If you heard the NPR report on today's news regarding this event, they interviewed local Iraquis, who said that 1 or 2 (then the guy quickly revised his number up to 10) Iocals attacked the American convoy. \r\n\r\nHe and a few other Iraquis who were interviewed said that after the attack began the American soldiers fired indiscriminately. An official at the local hospital said that 8 Iraquis had been killed, all of them civilans who were not participants in the attack, and 48 had been wounded.\r\n\r\nAltogether the NPR reporter interviewed about 5 people for his or her story (don't recall if it was a man or woman reporter).\r\n\r\nThe last part of the broadcast was particularly slanted, some wounded Iraqui youth was wounded by mortar fire (could have come from US side or from the attackers) he was interviewed in the hospital as his sister was weeping just out of his earshot. She told the reporter between sobs and sniffles that the boy's father and younger brother had been killed.\r\n\r\n-----------\r\n\r\nThis whole report was so utterly biased I thought I was listening to a pre war Saddam station or to Al Jazeera (except it was WORSE than Al Jazeera). \r\n\r\nI am not sure which NPR journalist put the report together but the way news was presented made the US soldiers look like insane ruthless cowboys and the Iraquis who got hit as innocent bystanders.....\r\n\r\nFor what it is worth, the convoy was delivering money to the banks in the town, and probably the assailants knew that if they succeeded they were going to get their hands on a lot of money. Presumably dollars as well as dinars, or whatever the currency is called in Iraq....\r\n\r\nNPR is a real problem with the bias in their reporting, they are often worse than the worst stuff you hear on KPFK or WBAI or KPFA. Incredible, isn't it? WGBH in Boston is the source of many of their worst "news" stories, especially their noontime program called "The World." Other NPR stations are hooked into WGBH as a feeder for a lot of national and international news.\r\n\r\nThe slant on the news one gets from NPR is OUTRAGEOUS and it is time to do something about it - among other things, if you subscribe to KCRW or KPCC you can STOP and tell them why - because you do not like the NPR "vision" of the world and the US.\r\nIf the station managers at these stations get enough calls and if they start to lose revenue on their fund drives, hopefully they will tell NPR that more balance is necessary. \r\n\r\n","author":"Federicus Maximus","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 04:38:48","modified":"2003-12-03 04:38:48","fileurl":""},{"id":96086,"heading":"The BBC is really biased too","article":"It's all stories portraying the US troops as marauding thugs. They seem to want our troops to go around doing market research in case the guy firing rockets at them is not actually a terrorist.\r\n\r\nThe BBC has had a left wing bias ever since the 60s but I've never seen it this bad before. Reuters can't be trusted either.","author":"Maelstrom","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 04:46:40","modified":"2003-12-03 04:46:40","fileurl":""},{"id":96093,"heading":"Gee maybe there weren't 54 or 46 or...","article":"...told you so morons;\r\n\r\nU.S., Iraqi police dispute death toll in ambushes\r\nGeneral: Coordinated attacks show little sophistication\r\nMonday, December 1, 2003 Posted: 7:06 PM EST (0006 GMT)\r\nhttp:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2003\/WORLD\/meast\/12\/01\/sprj.irq.main\/index.html\r\n\r\nKimmitt said the casualty reports were "visual battlefield reports ... from soldiers involved in the engagement. \r\n\r\n"That's why we have said all of these are estimated," he said. \r\n\r\nIraqi police in Samarra said they could confirm only eight deaths, including an elderly Iranian man believed to have been on a pilgrimage to a shrine in the town. The Iraqis said at least 50 people were wounded. \r\n===================\r\n\r\nU.S.: New Iraqi currency a lure for attacks\r\nCentral Command: GI killed Monday west of Baghdad\r\nhttp:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2003\/WORLD\/meast\/12\/01\/sprj.irq.main\/index.html\r\n\r\nIraqi police disputed the U.S. casualty information about the attackers, saying that only eight bodies were in the morgue, including two elderly Iranian pilgrims, and that none wore Fedayeen clothing. Police said 50 people were wounded. \r\n\r\nRudesheim conceded that some of the insurgents reported to be dead may actually have been wounded, because of the method that U.S. forces used to collect information about the firefight.\r\n===========================\r\n\r\nU.S. military says 54 Iraqis die in Samarra battle, but residents say death toll is much lower \r\nhttp:\/\/sfgate.com\/cgi-bin\/article.cgi?f=\/news\/a\/2003\/12\/01\/international0612EST0463.DTL\r\n\r\nThe U.S. military initially said 46 Iraqi fighters died and five American soldiers were injured. But a statement on Monday raised the Iraqi dead to 54. \r\n\r\nResidents of Samarra disputed those figures, saying at most eight or nine people died. Three bodies lay in the hospital morgue. There was no way to reconcile the accounts. \r\n\r\n========\r\n\r\n\r\n","author":"OzzyTeppics","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 05:28:27","modified":"2003-12-03 05:28:27","fileurl":""},{"id":96107,"heading":"even so","article":""saying at most eight or nine people died."\r\n\r\nStill, it's a start.","author":"fresca9809","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 08:30:27","modified":"2003-12-03 08:30:27","fileurl":""},{"id":96110,"heading":""scumbags?"","article":"Fresca, I'll get to your question in a second...\r\n\r\n"Scumbags"? "Savages"? I feel like I'm reading wartime racist propaganda here.\r\n\r\nBack to the lecture at hand...\r\n\r\nThe solution to terrorism? There's no easy solution; at least I can't think of one that we could implement quickly.\r\n\r\nThese retalliatory strikes against people who are defending their own land... that's a recipe for losing a war, and, probably, increasing terrorism against us.\r\n\r\nI'd like to see us get out of Iraq quickly. I hope that the people would be able to prevent the return of Saddam, but, if they can't... you know what they say: "the country will get the leadership they deserve." If the Iraqis want the UN there, they'll demand that the UN enter.\r\n\r\nAs for terrorism, probably, increasing democracy in their home countries would be a good start. There's insufficient freedom there, and the only outlet for the frustrated middle classes there seems to be anti-American rhetoric that turns into terrorism. (The Taliban, Al Qaeda, Shiites in Iran, all were or are composed of the middle class students.)\r\n\r\nWe can't very well tell them how to run their country. (Let's ignore Afghanistan, Iraq, and our meddling in Iran :-) ) We can, however, fund internal resistance against oppressive leaders. If someone is pushing for democracy, fund them. \r\n\r\nThese things, however, won't be happening any time soon. We're too hooked on supporting the local dictators.","author":"more rational","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 08:49:20","modified":"2003-12-03 08:49:20","fileurl":""},{"id":96111,"heading":"Jeez, more rational","article":""the country will get the leadership it deserves".\r\n\r\nWhat kind of a statement is that?? Do you suppose the Iraqis deserve to have had Saddam Hussein??\r\n\r\nWEIRD.","author":"Barney","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 09:04:03","modified":"2003-12-03 09:04:03","fileurl":""},{"id":96119,"heading":"a start","article":"""the country will get the leadership it deserves". "\r\n\r\nI agree completely with that.\r\n\r\nI also agree, in theory with your long term ideas about countering terrorism by supporting democracy as a means of countering anti-Americanism.\r\n\r\nBut.\r\n\r\nThe fact is is that these attacks which have been going on for decades need to be addressed directly. Ultimately, we will never teach or support our way out of the crosshairs of those who hate us PURELY on the basis of religion. Islamofacism is a very real global threat. Actually, it's not a threat, it's a fact.\r\n\r\nAs for Iraq, there is little evidence that anyone is "protecting their homeland". Fighting in an effort to regain a despotic power or as a direct method of jihad against the infidels is much more correct it would seem. But you are correct in the idea that we should ultimately let the Iraqis sink or swim on their own. As long as their leadership isn't a direct or indirect threat to us, as Sadam certainly was, I really don't care. I certainly never backed this war because I was soooo concerned about future Iraqui freedom, although that this war will lead to them having this opportunity at last is undeniable.\r\n\r\nMy point is that, unfortunately, I think that the world faces a threat in Islamic fundamentalism which can only be countered with direct force. I have very little faith - extremely little faith - that peace and understanding are going to bring about a seachange and evolutionary leap in a large segment of humanity which is perfectly content to remain in the bloody, hatefilled dark ages.\r\n\r\nBut who knows?","author":"fresca9993","parent_id":95958,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-12-03 14:54:18","modified":"2003-12-03 14:54:18","fileurl":""}]}