{"article":{"id":34575,"heading":"Which way forward for the development of a powerful anti-war movement?","author":"Ben Seattle","created":"2003-03-10 19:02:34","modified":"2013-11-10 23:48:59","last_modified":"Mon, 11 Nov 2013 06:48:59","article":"

Which way forward for the development
\r\nof a powerful anti-war movement?<\/p>

\r\n\r\n<\/p>
\r\n\r\n\r\nMillions are marching in the streets of hundreds of cities around the world to protest Bush's plan \r\nto invade Iraq and occupy the Middle East oil fields. These mass actions are a powerful blow \r\nto the plans of US imperialism and are complicating its war planning and even delaying \r\nthe war--but they will not prevent this war.\r\n
\r\nThousands of serious activists are giving thought to all questions related to the development of an anti-war movement that can strike even more powerful blows against this latest round of imperialist wars. This article represents an effort to directly confront the most serious questions related to the development of the anti-war movement.\r\n<\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n
\r\n\r\n

Question:<\/b>\r\nCan the anti-war movement become a more powerful social force than it is at present?\r\n<\/p>

Answer:<\/b> Yes\r\n<\/p>

Question:<\/b> How can the anti-war movement become more powerful?\r\n<\/p>

Answer:<\/b> The anti-war movement has already become large in size. \r\nThe decisive step forward is for the anti-war movement to develop in depth<\/b> \r\nso that it can give tens and hundreds of thousands a clear understanding of \r\nthe class nature of our society and the need to end the rule of the bourgeoisie<\/b>\r\n(ie: the class that owns the largest corporations and controls the Democratic \r\nand Republican parties, the courts, the police, the mass media, etc.)\r\n<\/p><\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n\r\n

\r\nHit them where it hurts\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/p>

The bankruptcy of the Democratic Party, which has rubber-stamped Bush's war plans at the same time as millions are marching in the streets against this war--helps to prove that American \"democracy\" is an illusion used to hide the rule of the rich. The anti-war movement, by exposing <\/b>the nature of bourgeois rule<\/b> (which launches one war after another) and the necessity<\/b> of breaking<\/b> the system of bourgeois rule--can help to smash up widespread illusions in \"bourgeois democracy\" and, by so doing, will greatly increase the social cost<\/b>, to the bourgeoisie, of the current round of imperialist wars.\r\n<\/p>

The experience of the movement against the war in Vietnam helps to prove this.\r\n<\/p>

As the anti-war movement developed, Democratic Party politicians (who had originally launched the war under Kennedy and Johnson) accused the Rebuplicans (who favored continuing the war under Nixon) of undermining<\/b> the system of bourgeois rule by continuing a war that was leading to the radicalization<\/b> of an entire generation of young people. This helps to illustrate what the bourgeoise fear most<\/b>. What the bourgeoisie most fear--is that tens of millions will recognise that the system of bourgeois rule stands as the fundamental obstacle to the forward progress of humanity<\/b> and must be broken<\/b> in order to bring an end to the current system which makes inevitable one imperialist war after another.\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/p>
\r\nThe anti-war movement will become an increasingly powerful<\/b> social force as it breaks from bourgeois influence<\/b> (ie: the orbit of the Democratic Party) and tells the masses the truth<\/b> about the need to end the system of bourgeois rule<\/b>.\r\n<\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n\r\n

\r\n\r\nHow to move the Democrats
to the left\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/p>

Such a course of action by the anti-war movement (ie: an orientation toward the masses and away from all bourgeois politicians) will certainly piss-off the entire strata of liberal-labor Democratic Party politicians who will argue that the \"smart thing\" is to work within the system and seek alliances with powerful saviors within the establishment (ie: Jim McDermott, Dennis Kucinich, etc.)\r\n<\/p>

According to this argument, we should focus our precious time and energy on attempting to move the Democratic Party<\/b> (an imperialist party, owned and controlled by the same big corporations<\/b> that control the Republican Party) to the left<\/b>.\r\n<\/p>

But if we want a section of Democratic Party politicians to move to the left--the most effective way<\/b> to accomplish this--is to turn our backs to them--and make clear that we recognize them as the flunkies of the rich<\/b> that they are. As the anti-war movement abandons illusions in saviors from within the establishment--the bourgeoisie<\/b> (which keeps these \"saviors\" on a leash<\/b>) will be forced to give them permission<\/b> to move to the left in order to better maintain the illusion that the system of bourgeois democracy<\/i> can be made to work in the interests of the masses.\r\n<\/p>

In this way the anti-war movement can help to transform the current political climate and greatly complicate the plans of the warmakers.\r\n<\/p>

Further, by developing in the direction of independence<\/b> from bourgeois influence, the anti-war movement will better prepare itself for the day when, as the bombs begin to fall, the \"saviors\" within the establishment attempt to pour cold water<\/b> on the idea of militant mass actions<\/b>.\r\n\r\n<\/p>

\r\nThe need for revolutionary organizations
that are deserving of the respect
of the masses\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/p>

Why is it so easy for liberal-labor politics to dominate the anti-war movement? Because at this time the progressive movement is naked to its enemies.\r\n<\/p>

The great problem of the present time is that there exists no genuinely revolutionary organization<\/b> that commands respect; that is deserving of the trust of activists; that has its feet on the ground and (to continue this analogy) does not have its head shoved into a place that can't be reached by sunlight. \r\n<\/p>

Hundreds of revolutionary organizations were created<\/b> in the U.S. in the wake of the the brutal police repression of the massive anti-war protests at the National Convention of the Democratic Party in Chicago<\/b> in 1968<\/b>. Most of these organizations considered themselves to be marxist<\/b> in one sense or another. Especially popular were Trotskyism<\/i> and Maoism<\/i>. At that time Cuba and\/or China were widely considered by activists to be models of societies that were not ruled by a privileged class.\r\n<\/p>

In the years since then nearly all of these groups have evaporated. The decline of the revolutionary movement was related to the ending of the war in Vietnam. But there were other reasons also. These groups fell victim to the diseases of reformism<\/b> (ie: essentially being in orbit around the bribed strata of liberal-labor politicians and their myriad institutions) and sectarianism<\/b> (ie: allowing the competition between rival groups to undermine the cooperation necessary for the development of the revolutionary movement). More than this, these groups were all undermined by the crisis of theory<\/b> (ie: the inability of the revolutionary movement to offer an alternative<\/b> to the capitalist-based system of bourgeois rule that would make clear<\/b> how the working class can run society better<\/b> than the bourgeoisie) which undermined their moral authority and the morale of their members--leading to demoralization and passivity.\r\n<\/p>

Today, anarchism<\/b> is rising in popularity but activists inclined in that direction are faced with the same problems as an earlier generation of activists: reformism, sectarianism and the crisis of theory.\r\n<\/p>

One big factor today that will assist in overcoming these problems is the transparency<\/b> that is emerging from the revolution in communications<\/b>. This will allow activists to better link up with one another and create revolutionary channels<\/b> of communication to the masses.\r\n<\/p>

Those activists who would like to see a mass trend develop that is (a) independent of the Democratic Party and the liberal-labor reformist swamp, and (b) not into religious cult-building, should link up with one another. A mass political trend that is independent of the bourgeois influence is needed. One step in bringing such a trend into existence--is to talk about it<\/b>. So let me hear from you.\r\n\r\n<\/p>

Ben Seattle -- March 5, 2003
\r\nhttp:\/\/struggle.net\/ben
\r\n(500 copies of the above leaflet were handed out at Seattle demonstrations on March 5 and 8)\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\nThe local left ecosystem in Seattle<\/b>
\r\ncreated for \r\nThe Future Transparent Workers' State,
\r\nan essay from\r\n\r\nThe Anarcho-Leninist Debate on the State\r\n\r\n<\/p>
\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/td><\/tr>\r\n
\r\n\t\r\n\tLegend of militant (or pseudo-militant) trends:<\/b>
\r\n\t\r\n\t\r\n\tSWP\r\n\t<\/b> = Socialist Workers Party, \r\n\tWWP\r\n\t<\/b>=Workers World Party (ie: leads \r\n\t\r\n\tA.N.S.W.E.R. coalition), \r\n\tSA\r\n\t<\/b> = Socialist Alternative, \r\n\tFSP\r\n\t<\/b> = Freedom Socialist Party, \r\n\tISO\r\n\t<\/b>= International Socialist Organization (corresponding to \r\n\tSWP in Britain), \r\n\tRCP\r\n\t<\/b>=Revolutionary Communist Party, \r\n\tCVO\r\n\t<\/b>=Communist Voice Organization,
\r\n\tAM\r\n\t<\/b>=anarchist movement.\r\n\t
\r\n\tThe placement of various militant-appearing trends in this diagram may be somewhat inexact or arbitrary.\r\n\tAny resemblance between the left wing of the Democratic\r\n\tParty<\/b> and the head<\/b> of a bloodsucking leach<\/b> is a coincidence.\r\n\t
\r\n<\/td><\/tr><\/table>

\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/p>
\r\nLinks<\/b>\r\n\r\n• Post comment<\/b>
\r\npost your comments, questions or criticisms
\r\n\r\n• Look at comments<\/b>
\r\nwhat do our readers say?
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nNo to Bush's war for oil and empire!<\/b>
\r\nOne of the best agitational leaflets I have read. Very useful to many activists \r\nattempting to make sense of the news and wondering what to do.\r\nWritten by supporters of the\r\n\r\nCommunist Voice Organization, who also wrote \r\nthis.\r\nUnfortunately these folks oppose transparency and are \r\n\r\nunable to deal with public criticism.
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nBehind the Invasion of Iraq<\/b>
\r\nThis may be the best in-depth analysis I've seen, going into Iraq's history, \r\nincluding Saddam's alliance with US imperialism against Iran
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nWhat is our alternative to imperialist war?<\/b>
\r\nA leaflet I wrote in February 2002
\r\n\r\n• \r\nThe Left Ecosystem<\/b>
\r\nArtist's rendition of the local left ecosystem \r\nand the bourgeois machinery of political control
\r\n• Seattle 2002
\r\n\r\n• \r\nResolving the \"crisis of theory\"<\/b>
\r\nHere are some of the highlights from \r\n\r\nthe anarcho-leninist debate on the state:\r\n• \r\n\tA scenario for the overthrow of bourgeois rule\r\n\tin the U.S. in the middle of the 21st century<\/b>
\r\n\tHere is one way events may unfold
\r\n• \r\n\tPolitics, Economics and the Mass Media\r\n\twhen the working class runs the show<\/b>
\r\n\t• Will there be elections?
\r\n\t• The three economic sectors\r\n\t(private capitalist, state capitalist, gift economy)
\r\n\t• The evolution of the mass media\r\n\t(commercial media, state media, free media)
\r\n• \r\n\tThe Future Transparent
  Workers' State<\/b>
\r\n\tWill a workers' state be a brutal police state\r\n\tor a machine controlled by workers?
\r\n• \r\n\tFinding the Confidence
  to Build the Future<\/b>
\r\n\tHow will the working class keep supply chains running\r\n\tand bourgeois apologists from flooding the airwaves\r\n\ton the morning after bourgeois rule is broken?
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nWag the Dog<\/b>
\r\nShould we support the Democratic Party? (An Indymedia thread)
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nAnti-War Portal<\/b>
\r\nThis obsolete skeleton can be considered an illustration or sketch of the kind of portal that is needed.\r\nThe anti-war movement needs something that is organized better than Indymedia.\r\nIt would be cool if there were one or more volunteers who were interested in keeping this updated.\r\nNo html skill required.
\r\n\r\n• \r\n\r\nBen Seattle's site<\/b>
\r\nIndex of my projects, elists, theoretical and infrastructure work
\r\n\r\n<\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n\r\n

\r\nWhat do you<\/i> think?
\r\nDo you like this--or think it's bullshit?
\r\nPost your comments \/ questions \/ criticisms here
\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n \r\n
\r\n\r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n Comments? Questions?\r\n -- everything in this form is optional --<\/b>\r\n\r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n
\r\n \r\n brilliant or bullshit?<\/b>
\r\n What do you<\/i> think about this essay?
\r\n
\r\n \r\n\t\r\n\t\r\n\t\r\n\t\r\n\t\r\n\t
 <\/td>\r\n\tReally cool !!<\/td>\r\n <\/tr>
<\/td>\r\n\tUseful, but maybe a few problems<\/td>\r\n <\/tr>
<\/td>\r\n\tNot sure--will think about this<\/td>\r\n <\/tr>
<\/td>\r\n\tSome real serious problems<\/td>\r\n <\/tr>
 <\/td>\r\n\tTotal bullshit<\/td>\r\n <\/tr>
<\/td>\r\n\tOther ...<\/td>\r\n <\/tr><\/table>\r\n <\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n \r\n\r\n
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\r\n\t• No threats   \r\n\t• No racist filth
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\r\n\r\n<\/p><\/td><\/tr><\/table>\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n<\/table><\/table><\/b><\/p>\n","contact":"","link":"http:\/\/struggle.net\/antiwar","address":"","phone":"","parent_id":0,"mime_type":"text\/html","summary":"Thousands of serious activists are giving thought to all questions related to the development of an anti-war movement that can strike even more powerful blows against this latest round of imperialist wars. This article represents an effort to directly confront the most serious questions related to the development of the anti-war movement.","numcomment":20,"fileurl":"\/uploads\/","filesize":null,"article_url":"\/news\/2003\/03\/34575.php"},"attachments":[],"comments":[{"id":122194,"heading":"Reply to absurd accusations that I am a cop","article":"Nearly two years after making this post I run into it again and find that POIO is accusing me of being a cop. What is his "evidence"?\r\n\r\n1. I use one kind of scripting (ASP pages used by Microsoft) rather than another (open source PHP). Millions of people use ASP pages. Are they all cops? I use ASP pages because I am familiar with them and don't have time to learn anything else. (Unlike POIO who appears to have plenty of time to write umpteen posts asserting that I am a cop on the basis of zero evidence.)\r\n\r\n2. POIO is unable to understand my argument that having a clear and realistic concept of our goal (ie: a world not ruled by the bourgeoisie) will be necessary before we can have a mass movement united around that goal. But the fact that POIO is unable to understand my argument (or that he might disagree with it) does not make me a cop. It only means that POIO is unfamiliar with many of the important theoretical questions which have led to a paralysis of the revolutionary movement. Apparently, POIO resents having to exercise his brain (maybe it is painful for him) and reasons that therefore I must be a cop.\r\n\r\n3. I used html "forms" in my post so that readers of Indymedia LA could see and respond to comments that were posted by Indymedia readers in other cities.\r\n\r\nNone of this is anything other than paranioa and ignorance. I have no ill-will toward POIO -- who appears to be a relatively inexperienced activist who has worked himself into a state where he probably drank too much coffee.\r\n\r\nI doubt very many people will see any comment that I write on a two year old page. (I only ran into this after LA Indymedia added a feature that allowed me to easily click on a link and see all my old posts.)\r\n\r\nIf anyone wants to find out about me and the community that I am helping to build -- check out http:\/\/MediaWeapon.com\r\n\r\nBen Seattle\r\nhttp:\/\/struggle.net\/ben","author":"Ben Seattle","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-02-08 00:01:26","modified":"2005-02-08 00:01:26","fileurl":""},{"id":122195,"heading":"POIO was a whacko nutcase...","article":"much like KPC, Meyer London, and the rest of the girls that post around here. In fact, I'd bet a paycheck that they're all the same person.","author":"Jack Mehoffer","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-02-08 00:08:11","modified":"2005-02-08 00:08:11","fileurl":""},{"id":122197,"heading":"yeah where is POIO?","article":"he was a light of insight and reason. That's why the trolls are bothered. ","author":"Billions Moron this War","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2005-02-08 00:32:23","modified":"2005-02-08 00:32:23","fileurl":""},{"id":34586,"heading":"I'm not sure","article":" "the need to end the rule of the bourgeoisie (ie: the class that owns the largest corporations and controls the Democratic and Republican parties, the courts, the police, the mass media, etc.)"\r\n\r\nIm not sure the bourgeoisie are the ruling class anymore. I think that they were the revolutionary class in early modernism but at this point the bourgeoisie is also under attack (shrinking middle class) by the plutocrats who run the military and corporate elite.\r\n\r\nTheir interests are very different from shop-owners, teachers, shoe store managers, etc..., pharmacists, doctors, etc... \r\n\r\n","author":"ronny","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-10 20:19:00","modified":"2003-03-10 20:19:00","fileurl":""},{"id":34666,"heading":"What do I think?","article":"I think you are in love with the sound of your own voice.\r\n\r\nYou should get along well in prison with Mr. Pootytang as your cell mate. \r\n\r\nYou two megalomaniac wackos were made for each other.\r\n\r\n","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 03:10:40","modified":"2003-03-11 03:10:40","fileurl":""},{"id":34673,"heading":"What do I think?","article":"<\/b><\/div><\/center>\r\n\r\nI think the supplied web form \/ input widget was not very well made as it did not close all its html tags. It is a bit redundant anyways, but like the article itself, a nice effort and a good step towards a bright idea.\r\n

\r\n\r\nI would warn similar activists to refrain from getting too caught up in the semantics of the moment though. We can squabble all day about what to do after the battle is won but that won't accomplish much as long as we continue to put off the conflict itself. While I realize that to expect everything to 'work itself out' is unrealistic, to worry at this time about how to create a perfect system that will never again need any sort of change or update is putting the cart before the horse in a big way.
\r\n","author":"Pissed Off In Ohio","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/html","created":"2003-03-11 04:00:53","modified":"2003-03-11 04:00:53","fileurl":""},{"id":34677,"heading":"Up against the Wall!","article":"Right, and until ho-chi Seattle figures out exactly what solution to put in place, let's just round up all of T H O S E bourgeois people... and get rid of T H E M.\r\n\r\nThen with all of T H E M out of the way, we'll be able to create our utopian dream society.\r\n\r\nNothing new. All ho-chi Seattle and company will succeed in creating is Chaos and misery.\r\n","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 04:16:00","modified":"2003-03-11 04:16:00","fileurl":""},{"id":34680,"heading":"As opposed to the War Hawks....","article":"...who specialize in creating misery and chaos.","author":"Diogenes","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 04:31:19","modified":"2003-03-11 04:31:19","fileurl":""},{"id":34703,"heading":"But at least we have a conscience","article":">>who specialize in creating misery and chaos.\r\n\r\nHmm.... right, like that in post wwII Japan and Germany.\r\n\r\nToo bad N. Vietnam "won" the war - we probably would have rebuilt their entire infrastructure for free.","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 05:52:04","modified":"2003-03-11 05:52:04","fileurl":""},{"id":34707,"heading":"Conscience?","article":"Is that the same Germany where we firebombed a non-military target (Dresden) killing thousands of civilians in a most horrific manner?\r\n\r\nIs that the same Japan that FDR forced into a corner thus provoking a retaliatory attack? The same Japan that was ready to surrender that had TWO CITIES and their civilian populations incinerated?\r\n\r\nIs that the same American Government that marched unprotected Soldiers into Ground Zero at Yucca Flats to see if they could operate in a High Radiation Environment?\r\n\r\nThe same Government that has conducted Biological Warfare Experiments on unaware Civilian Populations in the U.S.?\r\n\r\nOr is it the Government that sponsored the Tuskegee Experiment where 200 poor Black Sharecroppers were promised free medical treatment and then watched them slowly die a horrible death from untreated Syphilis? Done in the Name of Science.\r\n\r\nPehaps it was the government that has hornswoggled the American Populace, through their love of Country, into supporting Wars that were in the interests of the Elites running the Country but not the poor Bastards who did the fighting and dying?\r\n\r\nOr could you mean the government that conducted the MK Ultra Mind Control Experiments to see if they could brainwash people into bypassing their conscience?","author":"Diogenes","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 06:09:58","modified":"2003-03-11 06:09:58","fileurl":""},{"id":34717,"heading":"I hope you're wearing your Aluminum Foil Hat","article":"Meia culpa it's all our fault. What's an imperialist to do?\r\n\r\n**We pushed Japan into a corner? \r\n\r\nWas that before or after they slaughtered hundreds of thousands whilst invading China?\r\n\r\n**As for fire bombing desden... \r\nhey, war sucks, get over it. \r\nWanna compare attrocisities? Who walled up and burned the Warsaw ghettos?\r\n\r\n>>Or could you mean the government \r\n>>that conducted the MK Ultra Mind \r\n>>Control Experiments.\r\n\r\nDon't forget that foil hat, they're reading your mind right now \r\n\r\nHave a nice time at the Apokeelybse\r\nMax\r\n","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 06:40:46","modified":"2003-03-11 06:40:46","fileurl":""},{"id":34721,"heading":"Ok i suspected it before but...","article":"Now i'm positive. This guy is ALSO a spook. Damn, two in one day.\r\n\r\nWhy am i so sure?\r\n\r\nWell what first tipped it off is that his site is coded entirely in ASP. Activists *always* programmed in PHP. Why? Its open source, free, more widely supported, more stable, and all around smells better than ASP. Whats wrong with ASP? It was made by microsoft so it's subject to all their inherent server flaws (MS should, imo, stick to desktop os's), including but not limited to: It's way too damn expensive to implement in a real project, its not stable, its clunky to use (blah.bleh.blahblah.bleh.method(param1,param2); etc etc), its not stable, it requires 'certified' engineers, its not stable, etc etc. I could go on but this isn't a programming forum. Regardless, for all the reasons stated above, ASP is the language of choice of big business and american government. Go figure.\r\n\r\nSo that set off some warning flags.\r\n\r\nThen i started looking at this crap a little closer. It does nothing but try to promote his stilted version of activism, divide the democratic party, and 'baffle them with bullshit'. \r\n\r\nJust check out that diagram of a human spleen and tell me that isn't classic bullshit baffling, and if that doesn't convince you, peruse the vocab test at the end of his 'essay'. Totally unrelated to anything he was saying earlier, in fact seems totally unrelated to the topic of his article (in what way does quibbling over what to do post successful-revolution devolop a powerful antiwar movement?). It's just another attempt by the desperate right cointelpro freepers to dilute the cause, associate idiots with real activists, and preoccupy activists with arguing over their personal ideals while they should be out protesting.\r\n\r\nI had initially taken it to be incredibly poorly written tripe, but now i see it for what it is.\r\n\r\nTo anyone interested, i think a sure sign of these idiots is that they are always trying to sensationalize their name before their cause. A real activist doesn't give a shit if you remember their name. A spook plant wants you to remember their name so when they get arrested for molesting cattle in eastern mongolia, you will recognize their name and they will be mentioned as 'blah blah the goat molesting left wing activist'.\r\n\r\nWhat made me positive as to whats going on? The freepers lil bullshit 'know your enemy' post, talking about how afraid they are of this idiots ideas. Yeah. Sure.\r\n\r\nhttp:\/\/www.freerepublic.com\/focus\/news\/860807\/posts \r\n\r\nSuch obvious ploys. Such idiots. Who needs the comedy channel when you have "republican strategy".\r\n\r\nMr Seattle, or whatever your name is, anything to say for yourself? Anyone not a goverment goon care to speak up on this guys behalf","author":"POIO","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 06:53:47","modified":"2003-03-11 06:53:47","fileurl":""},{"id":34724,"heading":"Whoa, you may have somethin there POIO!","article":"\r\nYa mean Ho-Chi Ben is really a government spy?\r\n\r\nOh that's just so Bourgeois.\r\n\r\nWe'll it's just so hard to find good Marxists these days....","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:12:43","modified":"2003-03-11 07:12:43","fileurl":""},{"id":34727,"heading":"COINTELPRO Is Alive and Well","article":"I am not enough of a Programmer to pass judgement on technical specifics the one point that stood out in my mind is that people in the New Resistance are free spirits, giving, and as a consequence prefer open-sourced software. This is so true that I am inclined to grant credibility to P.O.'s conclusions elsewhere.\r\n\r\nAs for Circus Maximus you rebutted nothing and just resorted to the old Disinformation Specialist Technique of "if the facts are against you attack the messenger". How Passe' - people here have been wise to that one since you were a GS4.","author":"Diogenes","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:23:46","modified":"2003-03-11 07:23:46","fileurl":""},{"id":34729,"heading":"Before, or After?","article":"\r\nDid we "Push Japan into a corner" _before, or _after they invaded China and slaughtered hundreds of thousands?\r\n\r\nA) Before\r\nB) After\r\n\r\nThe audience is holding its breath!","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:31:50","modified":"2003-03-11 07:31:50","fileurl":""},{"id":34730,"heading":"that form is probably a tracking implement too","article":"DO NOT USE BENS FEEDBACK FORM\r\n\r\nIn light of the admins decision to not log IPs (a wise and prudent decision if i ever heard one), I think filters should be put in place to prevent people from submitting privacy invading 'stub-forms' like what Ho-Chi Ben (thats nice madmaxim, i'm stealing that :D) has implemented. Warning, submitting anything to this persons form directs you to who the hell knows where. Your IP is certainly being logged from it, in fact it wouldn't surprise me if there were implements to back track through your browsers history, and any other number of privacy infrenging bullshit measures. I haven't had the opportunity to thoroughly look for such measures yet, its late here and i'm tired but it wouldn't surprise me at all if they were there (they'd be javascript snippets, they can be hard to track down sometimes though).\r\n\r\nDefinately a spook.\r\n\r\nAgain, I would be happy to help upgrade the security of this site. I'm well qualified to do so. Naturally i would be willing to work hand in hand with other known trusted devolpers and would be totally cool with having my work reviewed by a panel of developers to insure that I am not a spook trying to monkey with the server to invade the privacy of the visitors of the forum.\r\n\r\nIn all reality though, the site admin can only protect the visitors privacy so much though. Are you using Proxomitron yet? You should be. It helps secure aspects of your privacy AND it removes popups AND it removes banners. And does a really spiffy job of it too. Lots more nifty features too, definately a highly recommended app.\r\n\r\nhttp:\/\/www.proxomitron.org","author":"POIO","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:34:07","modified":"2003-03-11 07:34:07","fileurl":""},{"id":34731,"heading":"I'm not biting","article":"The question of Japanese atrocities in China is irrelavant to the immediate debate. Unless you are asserting that is why FDR forced Japan into an economic corner by cutting their oil supply and freezing their U.S. Assets?\r\n\r\nOtherwise read "Day of Deceit" and "Pearl Harbor - The Mother of All Conspiracies". Both are heavily sourced with reference to U.S. Government Documents.\r\n\r\nYou have no leg, or any other appendage, upon which to stand. Ignorance is not an acceptable debate technique.","author":"Diogenes","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:39:09","modified":"2003-03-11 07:39:09","fileurl":""},{"id":34732,"heading":"Wooo Who!","article":">>since you were a GS4.\r\n\r\nHey, pay raise! - cool!","author":"MadMaxim","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:42:32","modified":"2003-03-11 07:42:32","fileurl":""},{"id":34733,"heading":"To site admin","article":"Please remove spook-boys

tags from his submission. There may be several. That should effectively pull the firing pin so to speak. If it turns out later that he isn't a spook and i'm just being paranoid, it would be easy enough to put back in later. \r\n\r\nI'm worried that people will interact with his bullshit before having a chance to scroll down here and read my warnings that i feel it is a privacy invasion implement to be handled very carefully.","author":"POIO","parent_id":34575,"mime_type":"text\/plain","created":"2003-03-11 07:46:28","modified":"2003-03-11 07:46:28","fileurl":""}]}