Evidence of Explosives In The Twin Tower Collapses.
The evidence that the World Trade Center towers were demolished is compelling. Photographs of explosives detonating during the collapse of both the north and south towers are presented below. They are taken from two (publicly available) videos of the collapses. Each frame has been numbered by its position in the video. Both videos were filmed at 30 frames per second, so an eight frame interval covers about one quarter of a second.

The most remarkable aspect of the World Trade Center towers demolition, is that such obvious evidence of the use of explosives, has been completely ignored by the media. This refusal to report the obvious, clearly illustrates that the "free press" is free, only in name, and anything but free in reality.

That such obvious evidence of explosives has remained "hidden in full view" approaches the unbelievable.

The South Tower.
The video evidence that the World Trade Center towers were demolished is indeed compelling. Consider the following frames which show two distinct lines of explosives detonating across the east face of the south tower.




Frame 147 shows a row of explosives detonating right across the east face at the 79th floor.
Frame 203 shows a row of explosives detonating right across the east face at the 75th floor.

The middle photos show the dust cloud from the explosions outlined in red.

The end photos show the relative positions of the two lines of dust and debris.

It has been claimed that the explosions of dust that span the east face of the tower, were caused by air being forced from the windows as the floors above collapsed. This explanation is obviously incorrect. If it was correct, such lines of dust would have been expelled from the windows of each floor in succession. That is, we would have seen such lines of dust expelled from floors 79, 78, 77, 76 and 75 in succession, but what we observe is an explosion of dust at floor 79, no new clouds of dust for a few floors, then another (larger) explosion of dust at floor 75.

The second line of explosives is much more powerful than the first, but the dust cloud from the first line of explosives, and the dust and debris from the upper floor collapse, initially obscure this.

The dust due to the visible explosions is a whitish grey. The dust from the demolition of the upper section (which is disintegrating as it falls) is dark grey. One wonders what caused this difference.




In the video, it is clear that the top 35 or so floors have snapped off and are toppling eastward. In the above frames, we follow the north-east corner of the tower as this 35 floor section descends. Using the north-east corner as a reference, I have outlined in red, the progress of this 35 floor section as it descends.

The first thing to note, is that the top section itself must be disintegrating, otherwise (as the above frames show) the top section would have extended far into parts of the building that are clearly, as yet, unaffected by the collapse.

But what could possibly cause the top section to disintegrate? And in fact, what could possibly cause the top section to almost entirely disintegrate, before the lower section begins to collapse?

You have to realize that most of the top section had not been affected by the aircraft strike or fires and was thus still the same immensely strong structure that had supported the building for more than 30 years. If this section was going to fall at all, this section would fall as one piece (like a tree in the forest). Unless, of course, this section had been laced with explosives and was undergoing a controlled demolition of its own, just a few moments before the lower part of the building was demolished.




The North Tower.



In the following set of frames showing the north tower collapse, pay close attention to the horizontal explosions of dust and debris that occur just above the red line marked on the above photograph.




Once again, note that the second layer of explosions is much more powerful than the first and that the dust cloud from the first initially obscures that of the second. Also, note the large orange areas of hot gas from the explosions. Recall, that this was about two hours after the aircraft struck the building, so there would be essentially no flammable material left on the floors from which the flash emanates (as the fire would have already consumed it all).

Note that the horizontal explosions of dust on the leftmost side of the tower are already visible and expanding in the first frame. These continue their expansion through frame nine and subsequent frames. Similarly, explosions of dust become apparent across the entire width of both (visible) faces of the tower, however, between frames 001 and 009 the television mast on top of the tower makes no downward movement at all. This shows that the horizontal explosions of dust and debris precede the collapse and thus cannot be the cause of it (in fact, it is these explosions that initiate the collapse).




That the horizontal explosions of dust precede the collapse is vividly expressed by the above animated-gif which alternates the first and ninth frames. This clearly shows that the explosions of dust were not caused by air being forced from the windows as the floors above collapsed.

Since the visible evidence points to only two layers of explosives per tower, one has to conclude that the aircraft were directed to hit particular floors (possibly by homing beacons in the towers). This would also explain the total lack of solid evidence for the "Arab hijackers" hypothesis (there was however, a quantity of laughable, obviously manufactured evidence, indicating that this was an attempt to frame the Arabs).

Of course the visible explosions (or at least their dust clouds) are only part of the story, as the main weight supporting columns in the central core also had to be weakened before the towers would collapse in the way they did. But what is visible, is more than enough evidence, to conclude that the towers were deliberately demolished.

The original north tower collapse video can be found here (0.8 MB).
The original south tower collapse video can be found here (1.7 MB).
An animated-gif from the video of the north tower collapse can be found here (0.9 MB).
An animated-gif from the video of the south tower collapse can be found here (2.2 MB).

To play the videos you need to download 3ivx. 3ivx is a plug-in for Windows Media Player and QuickTime. It enables the playing of DivX 3.x, 4.x, 5.x, OpenDivX, XviD, FFMpeg, AngelPotion, SMR, Philips MPEG-4, Apple MPEG-4, MS-MPEG-4v3, 3ivx D3, D3.5 and 4, RealMagic MPEG-4, Sorenson MPEG-4, Blizzard MPEG-4 and other MPEG-4 variants and the encoding of high quality MPEG-4 video. So, it is a must for your system. It can be downloaded from http://www.3ivx.com/download

The explosions again.

No matter how you look at the falling twin towers, only a person or group of persons with a political agenda would even venture to suppose what is said in text with the pictures is anywhere near the facts. I do not know the purpose of your site, but here is where the blame lies. Muslim terrorist flew two jet aircraft laden with fuel and passengers into the twin towers. The “explosions” you report are the result of the floors collapsing on top of the lower floors. The explosions are caused by the compression of air which blow the windows out

This is nothing more than another conspiracy theory that should rank right up there with the dead aliens at Roswell. I chuckle at the lunacy I see on this page. This site put Darwin on the spot, because if the Theory of Evolution were correct, you would not be here.

I wish you bad luck and oh, by the way, please have a horrible life.

...I don't want to look. I don't want to see the obvious. I might have to give up the Gee Duhbya Idol enshrined in it's own special place.

History shows that governments, corrupt ones, will do whatever is necessary to protect and extend their power. Outwardly the men who do this look sane. However, is September 11th the handiwork of a sane mind?

Read this for some historical perspective: http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE5/index.html

Remember:

Pearl Harbor is now proven to have been a provoked attack which Roosevelt knew was coming.

The Gulf of Tonkin Attack never took place and LBJ knew it and nevertheless callously used it as pretext for war.

Saddam had no WMDs®.

Would the government lie to you?

You wanna explain those mobile weapons labs? What about the mass graves?

WELL?????????

Two words: OVER ANALYSIS

"Pearl Harbor is now proven to have been a provoked attack which Roosevelt knew was coming.



Saddam had no WMDs®."

And of course you have reamms of evidence to support these opinions correct.
And by evidence, I do not mean any of your vanity sites, posted by, for all any of us know, by yourself.

Give me some coraborated valid nesw sources.

And rense and whatreallyhappened are NOT examples of this.

let's get Fox to say anything....

...and bangs into a telephone pole.

frescaw: Do your own damn research.

Never do you back up your "rebuttals" with anything other than slander and puffery.

I am not your personal research librarian.

There are at least 2 good books on the Roosevelt matter.

I notice you did not touch the Gulf of Tonkin.

Where are the WMDs®?

KMFA

Would somebody please help me take my head out of my ass?

"I notice you did not touch the Gulf of Tonkin. "

Of course I didn't.

Here's why.

I do easily accept that our goverment and leaders like all the world's power loving leaders have pull stunts like this and have lied to us for their own reasons.

I've never said otherwise.

The difference is this. I base my views on a csae by case analysis.

You, on the other hand, see a plot, conspiracy or outright nefarious lie in ABSOLUTELY EVERY action which our government has anything to do with. You cannot even concieve that events can transpire in this world WITHOUT the inclusion of some rogue element injected by our "fascist" leaders.

You accept every theory that points to a conspiracy of "them" aginst "us" that comes your way. Every one.

Conclusion: you have absolutely no ability or desire to think critically or to discern between fact or fantasy.

You know I'm right. You jump on EVERY conspiracy bandwagon that rolls through here.

It's ultimately people like you who pave the way for grievous misuse of power. You cy wolf soooo many times that the few times you may be right (even a broken clock is right twice a day) no one listens because you're identified yourself as a crackpot.

You are certainly intelligent enough to , at least, get the feeling, that the world in general is sorta of snickering at you as you rant and rave.

Whatever, this is all just a fascination for me, but for your sake, I wouyld hope you'd wake up.

We love you! Would you like some IDF menstrual pads signed by Ariel Sharon?

...while trying to pretend it is presenting an argument the entire screed amounts to nothing more than a personal attack.

No refutation of any facts.

Admission of only those it cannot avoid.

Imputing motivations for which their is no evidence.

Labeling with a dishonest label which is intended not to further the debate but to defame the person making the argument.

In a word frescaw's entire post can be summed up thusly: Dishonest.

"In a word frescaw's entire post can be summed up thusly: Dishonest."

I'll take that long-winded dodging of my assertions as a cowardly concession of defeat.

After all, You made the original claims. I asked you for verification. You did not give any (claiming that t"here are books out there" is NOT verification - "there are books out there" about Superman as well).

So don't tell me I need to prove anything. You're the one trying to sell your fantasies so back'em up.

But I do thank you for proving me right your inability to think critically.

By the way, having had both at one point, The Armalite- 180 is far superior to the mini-14.

Just an opinion.

Bend over, you cum dumpster.

Don't double time me. I've been bending over for you for years.

I'm a KOBE and I'm OK
I sit on a bench at CompNLA
I wear panties and a bra
Just like, my dear papa

I'm a KOBE and I'm alright
I spam the web with hate all night
I lie and slander, it's a hoot
Until, someone give me the boot.

No one comes by my shop anymore. All I have left is KOBE.

G-d came to me one night and said, "Small Balled Moron," Stephen is the anti-Christ. I thought, "my G-d, you are correct!" Stephen doesn't believe in G-d and he doesn't hate Muslims. He must be stopped! Besides, an an anarchist and anarchists are evil! Very evil!

So, with G-d's blessing, I went forth to harm Stephen. I only want to save him. Computers NLA has helped me in my mission.

We've read your writing. You're both perpetuators of hate. Please die.

"I notice you did not touch the Gulf of Tonkin. "

Of course I didn't.

Here's why.

I do easily accept that our goverment and leaders like all the world's power loving leaders have pull stunts like this and have lied to us for their own reasons.

I've never said otherwise.

The difference is this. I base my views on a csae by case analysis.

You, on the other hand, see a plot, conspiracy or outright nefarious lie in ABSOLUTELY EVERY action which our government has anything to do with. You cannot even concieve that events can transpire in this world WITHOUT the inclusion of some rogue element injected by our "fascist" leaders.

You accept every theory that points to a conspiracy of "them" aginst "us" that comes your way. Every one.

Conclusion: you have absolutely no ability or desire to think critically or to discern between fact or fantasy.

You know I'm right. You jump on EVERY conspiracy bandwagon that rolls through here.

It's ultimately people like you who pave the way for grievous misuse of power. You cy wolf soooo many times that the few times you may be right (even a broken clock is right twice a day) no one listens because you're identified yourself as a crackpot.

You are certainly intelligent enough to , at least, get the feeling, that the world in general is sorta of snickering at you as you rant and rave.

Whatever, this is all just a fascination for me, but for your sake, I wouyld hope you'd wake up.

The 3ivx plugin rocks. Thanks.

...if you strip away all the puffery frescaw's homily boils down to little more than name calling.

frescaw cannot cite any facts to support it's position.

Therefore the only line of attack for frescaw, and it's Post is just that an attack, is to resort to attacks against it's target's character, sanity, and credibility.

These are the stock in trade of the professional Shill - PsyOps - PR Flack.

Note the use of VERY BROAD generalized assertions. "You jump on every..." The reason for this is that if you bite on countering them you lose. Logically you cannot prove a negative. Trying to dispose of frescaw's dishonest arguments by arguing against them is like taking a swim in the La Brea Tar Pits. The best way to dispose of them is to show them for the dishonest tactics they are. That is frescaw's stock in trade, a total lack of honesty or candor. Take that away and you strip it of it's only weapon.

Notice the tactic here:

"It's ultimately people like you who pave the way for grievous misuse of power. You cy wolf soooo many times that the few times you may be right (even a broken clock is right twice a day) no one listens because you're identified yourself as a crackpot."

Here you have a twofer the price of one.

frescaw routinely defends the misuse of government power as in the Iraq Conquest.

"Cry Wolf" - discredit your opponents argument by associating it with a negative image.

And here is frescaw's major objection:

"no one listens because you're identified yourself as a crackpot."

Associate the person forwarding the information you want to discredit with a negative image in the hope that if it sticks then by discrediting the messenger you have discredited the message. This is known as an ad hominem attack (Latin for "against the man"). It is very good PR technique if you have no facts on your side and are busy spinning so that no one will notice that you have no facts on your side.

I'm sure the trap it hoped I would bite on was to go off on how dishonest the government is. I have no need to reinvent the wheel. frescaw does - it's spin machine is a wreck.

Thanks for the breeze. So, what, you're actually saying you DON'T jump on every conspiracy bandwagon that comes along? The record (IM LA database) proves otherwise.

"The record (IM LA database) proves otherwise."

Unsubstantiated Allegation

For more about logic, see:

http://www.intrepidsoftware.com/fallacy/toc.htm

You're an intelligent, thoughtful person.

Oops! Unsubstantiated allegation...my bad!

The article seems basically correct to me.

Engineer.

Good. That settles it. Diogenes, you got an engineer on board who agrees that the article seems basically correct. What more do you need!?! Now take the 'A' Train down to the courthouse and start handing out those subpoenas and let's get these evil people behind bars. I believe in you. You've got the evidence. Take it to court. Go for it!

After perusing the pics I have to say that the most impressive detail is the fact that they knew EXACTLY where to plant the explosives so that the damage done by the jets would end EXACTLY at the floor chosen.

Pretty damn impressive, especially considering the calculations involved in ascertaning exactly where, how fast and at what angle for BOTH jets to strike the buliding so that the resulting first wave of destruction would extend JUST high enough to NOT destroy the planted explosive system but JUST low enough so that the planned detonation did not happen on it's own several floors too low, thus giving away the nefarious plot.

Simply amazing. These fascists are really some evil bastards.

Or maybe...........

Yes, that's exactly what they believe.

I've said it before: no conspiracy theory is too far out, too involved, too convoluted, too improbable to believe, as long at it makes the Bush Aministration and /or the JOOOS look evil.

Around here. Occam's Razor is simply something they use to shave Shroedinger's Cat.

Pretty damn impressive, especially considering the calculations involved in ascertaning exactly where, how fast and....

I think this person is deliberately blind. He will accept that smart bombs can hit their target within inches but a smart plane (or as the article says, a plane following a homing beacon) which has much more maneuverability and is traveling slower, could not possibly be as accurate.

He/she is viewing the situation with large BLINKERS which clearly obscure the view.

>He/she is viewing the situation with large BLINKERS which clearly obscure the view.

Who could deny that. With that type of evidence, why hasn't anyone procured a lawyer and moved this case to trial? Do you know just how many prosecutors across this land would just love be the one to bring down a presidential administration, especially a Republican one? Man, talk about making a name for yourself. They'd be a hero to us all. And, with the evidence you have here, who wouldn't want to press this matter forward.

Get ye to a lawyer immediately and show him what you got. Tell him you need a prosecutor who'll go for blood. You'll have those Bushites in jail before supper time.

>He/she is viewing the situation with large BLINKERS which clearly obscure the view.

Who could deny that. With that type of evidence, why hasn't anyone procured a lawyer and moved this case to trial? Do you know just how many prosecutors across this land would just love be the one to bring down a presidential administration, especially a Republican one? Man, talk about making a name for yourself. They'd be a hero to us all. And, with the evidence you have here, who wouldn't want to press this matter forward.

Get ye to a lawyer immediately and show him what you got. Tell him you need a prosecutor who'll go for blood. You'll have those Bushites in jail before supper time.

Oh yeah,...

The law profession is run by the jews and masons.

These are the people most likely to have done 9-11.

So you would have next to no chance of doing what you say.

>The law profession is run by the jews and masons. These are the people most likely to have done 9-11. So you would have next to no chance of doing what you say.

Foiled again! Damn those Jews!

This place is Conspiracy Central. You clowns eat, drink and smell conspiracy. There's a conspiracy to spread Zionism, there's a conspiracy behind 9/11, there's a conspiracy to poison the pot supply, there's a conspiracy behind Enron; there's a conspiracy to hide all the other conspiracies; you name it and you guys reach for the Conspiracy Juice. Beats thinking, I guess. Challenge you on it and you besiege us with link after link proving your conspiracies. Holy cow, the paranoia on this board is so palpable (that means noticeable, for all you people in Huntington Pk) it's like swimming through smoke. I love it. Come on in, the water's fine!

Briggs: You are a fool.

Communism was an "open conspiracy" to take the world.

Yet even with a self confessed conspiracy right before your eyes, you insist that hidden conspiracies must be impossible.

Turkey.

9/11, don't you want to know who the conspiracy theorists believe is behide it?

No, tell me. No, tell me.

I don't WANT to know who they think is behind it, since I assume it's the usual wackos and space aliens, no doubt controlled by the CIA, along with rogue cast-offs of the old KGB; financing to be provided through a secretive swap derivative set up by Enron, with all records to be shredded by Arthur Anderson after a wild night of sex, cocaine, and quaaludes in Dick Cheney's underground bunker beneath the Playboy mansion. I need to be working on my taxes or maybe washing my hair instead, and so I regret to announce that I can't spend all my time in reviewing endless research. Let me know how it goes.

I see you singled out Jews above (protecting) and left them out in your last post (protecting them again)

So you are a Jewish apologist.

Did Jews do 9-11. Probably. Who else would try to frame the Arabs.

Who else would employ you to try and muddy the waters still further.

Did Jews do 9-11. Probably.

I wouldn't be so paranoid if Bo Gritz would stop following me around. Also, why are there two moons in the sky? Has anyone read Dhalgren backwards? How many anarchists does it take to form a consensus that perhaps it's time to change the lightbulb? I'd never want to be part of a conspiracy that would have me as a plotter. Oh, I'm so alone. Where are the Cheez-its? When will this nightmare end. There's a little Area 51 in all of us.......

sometimes in my dreams I see a statute of Jesus made entirely of cheeseburgers. Bo, you look so lovely in the moonlight......

I'd like to know who is behind this 9/11 conspiracy. These things don't happen without somebody planning them. I suspect a secret cabal of Trekkies, followers of Quisp and Quake, executives of the Sci Fi channel, and the radioactive beanstalks in the latest Stephen King novel. Also Regis Philbin, Dharma and Greg, Bart Simpson, Mary Mother of God, and followers of Norwegian Death Metal bands, or at least early Norwegian death metal bands before they sold out, the jerks. Did anyone see "Crossing Over" last night? Totally believable. I once owned a bicycle just like the one in E.T. Coincidence? I think not. Sometimes, at night when I stare up at the stars, I think I see the face of God. It's at moments like this that I'm glad I was born without antenaes and that the Northern Lights are so beautiful I could just cry. There's a light that never goes out. Can I have a Pepsi? Somebody just give me a Pepsi. You're so beautiful when you look at me like that.....

talk about blithering! nessie never actually began a
diatribe as idiotic as this last spasm. doing good, brigg.

I'd like to know who is behind this 9/11 conspiracy.

The idiots like brigg tell us 9-11 is an Arab/Moslem conspiracy.

Some see it as an American conspiracy (against themselves).

The more perceptive will tell you it is a Jewish conspiracy.

However, note that everyone thinks it was a conspiracy of some kind.

I'd like to know who is behind this 9/11 conspiracy.

The idiots like brigg tell us 9-11 is an Arab/Moslem conspiracy.

Some see it as an American conspiracy (against themselves).

The more perceptive will tell you it is a Jewish conspiracy.

However, note that everyone thinks it was a conspiracy of some kind.

Well I guess we now have a fresh aproach (not)to discredit
this event as a 'jewish' conspiracy. Bull Shit. Just like
most americans are not members of the CIA, most jews are not in the mossad. Weak try, bonehead.
Do you think we are as stupid as yourself?
Please get real.

most americans are not members of the CIA, most jews are not in the mossad. and most Americans are not Congressmen and most Americans are not making the decisions that "America" makes and most pigs don't fly.

What am imbecilic comment of yours.

Do I think you are stupid: yeah I think you are stupid.

So try something less stipid as a title or a little more specific as a bugerman than 'jewish'.

Wow, no-one has presented any evidence at all that contradicts the article. I guess it must be correct.

...looky here. Al Qaeda admits ONCE AGAIN they did it.

From http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&e=1&u=/ap/20030521/ap_on_re_mi_ea/al_qaida_tape

'"Consider your 19 brothers who attacked America in Washington and New York with their planes as an example," said the voice, speaking the classical Arabic typical of al-Qaida statements and making the accent difficult to place. Children's voices could be heard in the background.'

Hmmm...anytbody got anything stupid to say about Bush and Jews now?

Yeah,....... Jews did 9-11. It is obvious.

n Washington, U.S. intelligence analysts
were reviewing the tape. A U.S. official,
speaking on condition of anonymity, said it
was plausible that the speaker was
al-Zawahri but a thorough analysis was
necessary to be certain....
Nawaf Obaid, a private Saudi oil security analyst with close contacts
to the Saudi government, said the three were part of a larger cell
that was "in the process of carrying out suicide attacks against
landmarks in the kingdom."

"Wow, no-one has presented any evidence at all that contradicts the article. I guess it must be correct."

Here's how it works. The "article" is attempting to float an opinion or idea that tries to condradict known mountains of evidence. (Visuals of the planes hitting the Towers. Admissions of culpability from several planners, both written and videotaped, etc., etc.,).
There's no need to disprove an opinion that attempts this.
The onus is on the article to prove the accepted evidence false.
Just so you know.

Just so you know, you wouldn't know your head from a hole in the ground.

...that supports the article. I guess it must be incorrect.

Another interesting question to the conspiricy boys is "how would a building colapse if It WAS hit by a huge plane and colapsed because the steel melted."
I mean if a section of steel gives (it certainly is not going to happen at exactly the same instant) and that section begins to colapse will the air and dust and energy in that section just move out from the building without a noise? what if the fire burn down a door and you get one of those fireball effects .?
hmm lots of reasons...

how would a building collapse if It WAS hit by a huge plane and collapsed because the steel melted

It would collapse as the south tower initially did. The side that collapsed first would cause the building to topple to that side. It would then continue to topple (instead of exploding apart as it did) and fall like just like a tree, wiping out buildings for hundreds of feet in the direction that it fell. That is how it should have fallen.

...is "the fire didn't get hot enough to melt the steel."

It didn't have to. The steel was weakened, not melted.

concrete encased steel cored buildings?
with kerosine. How long have you been...
when did this first occur to you?

So, I guess what all you conspiracy buffs are saying, when you get right down to it is that it was an AMAZING coincidence that the obviously Arab terrorist hijacked planes just happened to slam into the WTC at exactly the same time the Jews or whoever you children are blaming this week, decided to implode and destroy the buidings.
Hmmmmm. Imagine that.

I love this conspiracy stuff because it so amply calls attention to the intellectual insufficiencies on the left.

The more left wing whacko's who buy into this nonsense, the more votes for GWB in the next election. In other words, the message really being sent by postings like the one starting this thread is:

"Vote Republican! These left wing loonies are completely off their rockers."

You might be right BA, but I suspect that the fools who are so far gone as to believe all this tripe are way too damaged to vote in the first place. They probably think the booths are rigged and THE MAN is gonna follow them home to their Mother's basement and take away their twine ball and comic collection.

concrete encased steel cored buildings?
with kerosine. How long have you been...
when did this first occur to you two nitwits?

What the hell are you going on about? You know less then nothing about what you're trying to speak about.

Here's a repost for you and by the way, spell salAmander right.

After perusing the pics I have to say that the most impressive detail is the fact that they knew EXACTLY where to plant the explosives so that the damage done by the jets would end EXACTLY at the floor chosen.

Pretty damn impressive, especially considering the calculations involved in ascertaning exactly where, how fast and at what angle for BOTH jets to strike the buliding so that the resulting first wave of destruction would extend JUST high enough to NOT destroy the planted explosive system but JUST low enough so that the planned detonation did not happen on it's own several floors too low, thus giving away the nefarious plot.

Simply amazing. These fascists are really some evil bastards.

Or maybe...........

don't make fun of my name, miss soft drink.
how much experience with demo or fire do you have for me to
fully appreciate your opinion? I'm curious.

What opinion would that be?
If it's the opinion that controlled explosions coincided with an almost improble precision to the arab hijcked planes crashing then what would knowledge of fire or demos have to do with that?
I do have a degree in physics however so I know a little about forces and stress.

Salimander, you must be able to recognize how poor spelling and grammar does little to convince people that you're educated at all, let upon educated about such a specific and scientific topic.

I might value your opinion and choose to agree or disagree with it, and I might value what information you've collected from other sources, but I refuse to believe the merit of any factual conclusion you've come to on your own, especially regarding such a topic as this.

of miss spelling.
my own nick, I suppose. please don't hurt me. I'm delicate.
Well fresca, since you have this degree in physics
perhaps you can dispute the fuel/energy analysis in
http://la.indymedia.org/news/2003/05/55902_comment.php#59757

Good article (the first one).

The rest are real trashy (I gave up reading them, they were so bad).

Not that my physics degree has really much to do with it but here goes.

To the extent that any of this theory about burning jet fuel energies and the resulting material deformation is even correct or relevant, it leaves out a HUGE pice of the equation.

All of these dubious formulas assume a perfect system. That is, fuel burning on a floor of a building UNDAMAGED by a jet airliner crashing into it.


Now, even if I didn't have a physics degree, I could tell you that adding that into the system changes things dramatically and SEVERELY lessens the impact of the burning fuel on the final state of the system.

None of these equations or theories even remotely take into account the catastrophic effect of such a colision and the resulting degredation of the building's structural integrity.

so, tell me, what about that theory has you convinced?

fresca, lying about its qualifications. If we were talking fire at the WTC, it would be fire design expert.

I guess fresca LIES so often that everyone realises this and ignores its dribble.

I guess that is a question I would like to turn about.
What makes you think the lies, half truths and suppression
of evidence leads you to believe any of the official fairy tale?

...an expert in Structural Engineering and Materials Science as well? New one on me. I always thought a BSEE conveyed an apparent knowledge in Electronic Circuit and System Design. A new revelation.

Of course the foregoing is sarcasm as I firmly believe that it is possible for the intelligent reasonably well Educated Layman to be able to figure things out for themselves and look up references for what the don't know.

For the curious good starting points are:

"STRUCTURES or Why Things Don't Fall Down"

And

"The New Science of Strong Materials or Why you don't fall throurgh the Floor"

Both are By J.E. Gordon Professor of Materials Science at the University of Reading (Probably Retired by Now but that is what he was doing when he wrote the books.)

They are written for the intellingent Layperson and require no advanced Mathematics. And are a fun read to boot.

All disagreement aside,
Thank you for the book refferrals.
I'll try and check them out...

In addition to the degrees I've spent years making records and videos and touring which gives me great insight into material science and structural integrity of tall buildings.

The only degree that fresca has is one in bullshit.

It is just one of the professional liars (who usually argue both sides of any topic, in order to better direct the conversation).

How did you know that I'm fond of scat?

I will volunteer to build them. My sponsors in Harbor City will host my website collecting contributions for the construction of camps. I will repay them with profits made from selling gold fillings.

Fuck whiny assed libertarians like me in the bung hole!

But I also like the feeling of a penis in my anus.

Eric: I'm a fascist

Yes I believe you and your kind are indeed fascists.

huh? when did eric post in this thread and how did he become part of this conversation?
and what has he ever said that sounds facist anyway?

Can you not read? I mean, I knew that you were stupid, but damn!!!!

...supports King Shithead's theory about SOME people not being able to tell the difference, but yeah, these tend to
be a bit dull, as referenced by Scottie's post.

Do you mean the post above yours?
surely anyone with half a brain would realise that noone on here posts under their own name and says "I am a facist" even if they are one.
And if he was gay he would be unlikely to bring it up out of the blue in the middle of a debate on somthing totally different

having an IQ higher than 50 allows one to figure that sort of thing out.

conclusion? the most likely suspect is you TED. (since you posted next in such a beligerant way)
which means you said you were a gay facist.. I fully expect you to recant that now.

We just received your membership application in the mail. We'll get back to you soon.

DioScottieBrigg & Sheepdog, on your faces when
you speak, or its back to Submission 101-got It-"Don't"
look up, once more-got It-"Sit"again,once again-got It-"Stand"good dogs, for luck-got It-"Lets" see It in
reverse, perfect...

LA is full of fuckwits.

or is it just one shill with different self-multiplied nix?

judging from the sheer amount of daily shill spam on LA,I'd say there's a couple of them or maybe even 3.

how do you know that they live in LA?
in the expanding government jobs program known as
'anti-terror' they could be from anywhere.

I didn't say shills are from la - by la I menat la indy,the site.

actually,I think the shills are from the east coast,because the site has la times and the shills start spamming at ungodly hours for la like 5 am or sth...

odd,for 9 to 5ers...

maybe they work out of langley or the pentagon.

<>
Gee, thats good news.

Jews did 9-11 Jews did 9-11

"maybe they work out of langley or the pentagon."

You got us!

Could you be ANY more deluded?

that I'm almost ready to believe it. Just post it a few more times and I'll be ready to accept the truth.

XXX obviously found the whole thing very traumatic and is trying to shield himself from reality.

Fresca is deluded. disregard all posts by fresca. Fresca is only here to be jealous of everyone else.

Fresca is deluded, VERY deluded.

It's good to be so popular.

Yes, very little.
I also have an EE degree and although I know electron flow theory and circuit design, I use mechanical engineers to provide
structural knowledge. Stick to the J-fets and ICs.
Leave the physics to the physicists. Otherwise, you are living in the
j axis.

For you "Alternative 9/11" afficianados, was some segment of Saudi government/intelligence in on the plot? If so, why are the Saudis allowing themselves to get grilled so badly this week? Why don't they tell the world the "truth" and get the Americans off their backs?

How much in the way of U.S. t bonds and bills does the Saudi familly
actually own? And how much do we depend upon them to not cash them in? Hmmmmm?
I heard it was in the trillions.....

http://news.ft.com/s01/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1028185935304&p=1012571727102

Medlej al-Medlej, executive director of the US Saudia Arabia Business Council in Washington, whose members include big oil companies like Exxon Mobil as well as banks, said: "We are hearing that the US is no longer the best place for Saudis to send their money. There is a growing impression that the US is no longer a safe haven for investment and we agree there must be some investors who are pulling out of the US."

Mr al-Medlej said there was a perception that since the September 11 terrorist attacks, the US was no longer a safe haven. "I honestly don't believe that the money moving from the US has anything to do with politics, but with security, in terms of the trillion-dollar lawsuits filed against Saudis after September 11 [by victims' relatives]." Mr al-Medlej said there was "a huge amount" of Saudi money in the US, mainly in equities and property. "We hear as much as $600bn to $800bn, and I don't think a large portion of that is leaving."

But not everyone agreed there had been multibillion outflows of Saudi money. Peter Scaturro, chief executive officer of Citigroup private bank, said his company's relationship with Saudi investors had not changed. "We are not seeing any real change in clients in the Middle East. We are in constant dialogue with them."

After all the time this silly thread has been running, the obvious is still clear.

There STILL is no evidence of explosives at the World Trade Center.

Short of the jets the arabs crashed, that is.

theres no proof of "Arab" terrorists being on the planes either.

I have believed for somen time now that the twin towers didn't collapse because of the impact of the planes. This just re-enforces my belief. Just wish i could see some tapes of the towers collapsing.

But basically all of this is about oil.

Citozen You are a racist pig, just because a muslim is supposed to have flown a plane into the twin towers dosent mean they r all bad, and what does it matter if they where muslim or not, givin half a chance i might do exactly the same (although i am christian) to show what a pile of racist dirt your country has been reduced to.

But i realised something, if this is the truth that explosives were used, and that the supposed terroists didnt do it, the whole world could never know. The truth would hurt more than the lie has because countrys would be outraged and would start WW3.

This is in protest towards the organization "citizens for police" who are constant "trolls" on this site. This organization is formed by ignorant racist white people in favor of jeremy morse. Jeremy morse is the "cowardly" officer from inglewood california who is on trial for the chickenshit beating of an innocent child last july 6th 2002.

These images were captured by mitchell crooks who was present at a hotel nearby the gas station where, Coby chavis the father of 16 year old donovan jackson was parked pumping gas. Several LA county sheriff cars descended to a "parked car" and found a black man driving a "taurus" (found to be too good a car for a black man by racist police) with unregistered tags.

As mitchell crooks found in his young life, Cops have a hatred towards black people and whites who think about living in a unified world. This is how they (cops and law enforcement) infiltrate our way of being. Anyone who has ever been in prison knows how the cops keep order because of the hate they spread. They could not maintain control of the prisons or society's without spreading the racism. This is the ONLY reason they remain in control and corrupt.

So back to the incident. 16 year old special Ed student Donovan jackson purchases a bag of chips with the money left over by paying to fill his fathers tank. Meanwhile after drinking heinekens all 4th of july weekend, mitchell crooks is laying down in his hotel room. Donovan walks out of the small little convenience store to find his dad in a police car for unregistered tags on his car. All this time, a young man from New zealand is taking pics of the arrest from the balcony of the hotel. (this man was flown in by the jeremy morse defense to testify against Donovan jackson) After returning to his fathers car, a hothead pig asks donovan to get out the car and put his hands up. An innocent teen who goes to church and is respectful to all? Donovan was scared to death because he knew he did nothing wrong. But, when your black, pigs hate you regardless. This pig was threatened by donovans black skin. He ordered him to stand still and not move. Donovan then put his hands in his pocket. Having nothing to fear (why wouldn't he?) he reached for his pocket and thats when the inglewood PD showed up at the scene. 5 police cars total. For unregistered tags?

Inglewood PD had been briefed earlier that a "GANG" was planning a hit on a cop. And sadaam had weapons of mass destruction too? This is the excuse by the department for their actions this day. Donovan is NO gang member. His father had plates on his car, I m sorry a sticker on his car that was expired. (prolly due to the outrageous cost of registering a car which the majority is fully aware of. No officers in inglewood were "HIT" on that day or since?

So on this Holiday weekend, when amerikkka is celebrating it's independence from europe, A "terrorist" opens fire at the el al terminal at Los Angeles international airport (LAX) killing two people. He was shot and killed by airport security. The Homeland Security was on high alert since the terrorist attack on 912. Shouldn't we be more concerned about protecting the citizens from terrorists? An unregistered car is hardly a terrorist threat. All this time mitchell crooks is about to uncover a terrorist plot himself.

Alot of different stories about what happened after donovan put his hands in his pocket have emerged. first, nobody found a gun or a weapon on donovan. That is fact. Donovan did nothing wrong. In fact, his father was detained over an unregistered tag. That is fact. Now if donovan jackson was going to put a hit on a cop, i am the fuckin pope.

Donovan was "ATTACKED" by several officers and dragged by his "bling" (a necklace to the ignorant) across the ground by jeremy morse and bijan darvish. He was assaulted by carlos lopez (the sheriff sergeant on scene) as well as all the others. Donovan fearful For his life and knowing he was innocent, struggled to keep free from the Harassment of these pigs. He did nothing wrong. He was afraid of them. They were bigger and threatening HIM. Donovan was hit over the head with a flashlight and punched several times in the head. He was BEATEN by the LA sheriff and inglewood PD. All because his father did not fill some paperwork out at DMV.

This entire time, the man from new zealand (is that fag country) was taking pics of the arrest. Yet he was nowhere to be found once mitchell crooks started shooting the incident. A woman was watching the whole scene and was screaming and yelling during the whole scene. Now this woman is the true hero. She had the presence to yell the keywords out. "Dont resist" & "Stop hurting him" & "help"! she is the true hero of the day! Those keywords gave me the knowledge that pigs were hurting yet another human being. She was also not asked to testify during the trial of jeremy morse? Why? Because the District Attorney is in bed with the Police (fags). They are working together on many issues. Thats why we need a separate police prosecutor to get these pigs when they are out of line. PIGS NEED TO POLICE THEMSELVES! We need alot of extra shit like a police prosecutor and a new justice department. "You are so out bush it's not even funny". You can see my statements on that @ http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/Personal22.html at the october 22 2003 protest against police brutality http://www.october22.org/index.php

So as this woman was screaming I looked out my window and thought it was a fight at the hotel. When she said "RESIST" I knew it was my clue to grab my Sony digital8 camcorder from my backpack. The citizens for police org have stated "why do we pander to these lawless individuals?" I had been on a trip around the divided states of embarrassment. http://www.angelfire.com/hiphop/edog/lyrics/2.html or watch the flash movie here http://www.sundanceonlinefilmfestival.com/animation01_15.html
I was traveling around the states to film a documentary about america and it's rave culture. I had no idea the project would turn into a political one.

I raced out to see this woman in panic. She was keeping her kids inside the hotel room so they couldn't see the police terror going on across the street. I flipped open the view finder on my camera and started filming the incident.

When I saw donovan laying there I just started to cringe. I thought "what could he have done to deserve that treatment?" I had no idea he was a child. I thought he was a 19 or 20 something. I was freaked out by the fact that if I was filming police doing wrong I would be targeted next. As I said on my Videotape. http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/iMovieTheater14.html I was told by the woman, you can hear on the tape, "they are not going to come after you". Huh I knew better!
You can see the video for yourself unedited at the above link or at www.noreversal.com

So, as I was filming this "terrorist attack" by police, I thought "they are going to arrest me and punish me for doing so". I was right. More on that later. I was shocked by the coward doing this in broad daylight! There were about 20 witnesses on scene and not one of them was asked to testify at jeremy Morse's first mistrial. The DA is in bed with pigs remember?

So after I videotaped the incident I gave the tape to friends cause I knew the cops would confiscate the tape and that would be the end of that. I also separated the camera from myself and changed my clothes. I knew these foreign backpackers only a little but they knew what they had seen on the videotape was wrong. The pigs came into the hotel and asked alot of people "who was the one who videotaped the incident?" Nobody snitched. Even though 90% of them knew I was the one. I grabbed a heineken and went down by the pool where people are still enjoying their fourth of july weekend. I sure as fuck did! After 912, police were regarded as heroes and shit cause a couple of the died at the trade center. So I reminded the entire world how fucked up our police Still are. haha.

I went to NBC 4 and showed them the tape. They were not interested. Because I had seen police brutality all the time in LA, I thought the media was not going to take on the situation. I went back to the hotel. Later that next day, I had an appointment to see a potential loft in downtown LA. I went to that and on the way back, I went to UPN and thought they would like a copy for the news. I was happy if they showed it. When they offered 150 dollars I was excited. The News director told me to keep the rights and sell it to as many news outlets as possible. Thats when the inglewood PD was informed. I sold this tape for 150 dollars to several local news outlets. Which is a rip-off considering that the guy who videotaped the rodney king video made 50,000 dollars initially. So to those who say I did it for money, "FUCK YOU" I did it cause it should be done. The world wind of media kept calling from all over the world and wanted the permission to show this video.

IF YOU WANNA BLAME SOMEBODY, BLAME THE "RIGHT WING" MEDIA. NOT ME. lol.

So as soon as the police did a search on me and my name they found a misdemeanor warrant for petty theft and Dui. What you do not know, is that the patriot act has been used so many times against people it was not designed to do. For instance, I was arrested in front of CNN for misdemeanor crimes out of placer county. I was staying in a hotel (leparc in west hollywood) when a DA (steve cooley) from LA tried to illegally supeona me on a radio show. He wanted the video. When I refused to give up my location to him he enacted the patriot act. Actually to be even more honest, FBI or "whoever" were parked outside my hotel room w/ headphones on, listening to me and a friend inside the hotel the night before. When I refused to accept this Illegal supeona to testify before the grand jury, I left the hotel for fear of what I saw the night before. I was appearing on BET w/ Ed Gordon That night (w/congresswoman maxine waters). Twice that night and in the morning, my friend was approached in the hotel, by plain clothes and actual officers demanding him to tell me where I was. How did they know where I was? They had to have illegally tapped the land line inside my hotel during the radio interview. I was not registered at the hotel? I then went to a different friends house in long beach when I noticed cops casing his apartment even before we got there! Tell me how they could know this? Later that night after going to a bar, two undercover cops sat next to me and my friend till we left. They left. I stayed at his house all night long and heard people outside his door all night. Then, the next morning I call my original friend on a cell phone and he is scared to death. I call from CNN inside the building on a land line. He had a cell phone. I told him to bring the tape to CNN and the camera because I was to go onto another BET show taping out of the CNN building.

As soon as he showed up, I mean within seconds, I was standing outside smoking. He dropped off the tape and 7 or so plain clothes officers assaulted me and threw me in a unmarked suv w/ tinted windows. CNN later came out and Showed the world my arrest for misdemeanor crimes that WERE NOT IMPORTANT UNTILL Capturing police doing wrong. At least 5 DOCUMENTED times, I was let go cause the warrant was not that big a deal. Now the whole world knows.

So many of these "PIG LOVERS & RACIST TERRORISTS" have pointed out that I stole VCRS from my mom and had a DUI. Why is that important? Because the LADA used this to arrest me. I refused to testify to the grand jury w/o a lawyer. These warrants were not a big deal until I came forward with the tape. That is FACT. I was stopped in sacramento (one county over from Placer county) Albakurkee NM and in New york and by LAPD in fall 2003 for jaywalking by ofc. v.perez. I was let go after being booked at the culver city police department. I have proof. He should be in jail according to DA steve cooleys explanation to the LA city council that it is illegal to let someone go with knowledge of a warrant. I was refused entry to canada because of the warrant and was let go? If this warrant for misdemeanor crimes was so awful then, why didn't they arrest me then? Cause I did not film police brutality till I returned to my home LA. The charges were so PETTY that my mother was upset about the focus being turned onto me and not the pig jeremy morse. I had pawned a VCR that was in my room at my moms house in 1999. The cops had found the pawn slips in my car and trumped the charges in order to secure giving me more time in placer county jail. See I was the victim of a police attack in placer county CA as a youth (16 too?) and they hated me for it. Since I was not at fault (and the officer) they had a deep-seeded hatred towards me. If I had a competent public pretender at the time I would have beat all the charges. I was duly convicted and plead guilty at the first court hearing. (never do that) My lawyers wanted to appeal the original plea to try it again cause the charges were so weak but that would take 6 months or more. I was sentenced to six months in jail for a 0.08% dui and a petty theft w/ prior.

Even tho the LA county jail had a program were they were kicking out inmates w/ misdemeanor crimes, a private jet flew me to placer county jail the day after the LADA and sheriff assaulted me for videotaping their own "terrorists". I was beaten severely by LADA's and handcuffed for 24 hours str8. That is illegal. That is fact. I was refused a visit from my lawyers and kept in a cell handcuffed to the outside of the cell all night. I was hospitalized for my injuries by the LADA.

I had to serve my six month sentence anyways. I was let go on Jan. 4 2003. I have no charges and no probation/fines/classes so that is good. It worked I am no criminal. I had been turning my life around since 1999. I appeared on the TV show 7th heaven 3 times and turned it around. (check out the episode when the oldest son left the show after getting hitched to a Jew.) Even though, the judge couzins wanted to give me 2 years for bringing attention to the most racist jail in amerikka. Placer county is so corrupt. http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/iMovieTheater15.html They have a 92 % white population and have the largest republican county in Califas. They were so pissed off to see the public focusing in me. Congresswoman maxine waters along with democrat candidate al sharpton called them and threatened them that if anything was to happen to me, they would be in serious trouble. So they put me on 23 hour lock-down for 6 months. They said they needed to protect me from White power inmates? These same white power inmates I got along with and were happy to see the pigs in trouble and sweat-in.

So jeremy morse was put on trial at the end of july 2003 (a year after) and was found basically guilty 7 to 5. The jury was not even given a good case but LADA's max huntsman and mikey petterson blew the case on purpose to satisfy the public. The trial was held in a courthouse nowhere near the crime scene in inglewood. The DA called all the defenses witnesses (the cops) and not a single other witness involved. they used the tape but did not supply the jury with ALL THE FACTS. The other officer Bijan darvish who beat donovan jackson was let off because the current footage does not show him beating him. He was charged with filing a false police report. That child abuser jeremy morse goes back on trial in january 2004. The trial was to start oct 22 but was moved yet again.

The media was hoping for a riot and thats the only reason why they even bought my tape in the first place. They were hoping for the bigger picture. They were disappointed that inglewood did not respond by burning their own businesses and homes. This is what the citizens for police (jeremy morse pig lovers) says is the reason for the retrial. "To award a community for not burning their homes down is crazy" is what they and jeremy morse attorney john barnett (defended the rodney king pigs) is saying? That is sooooo ignorant! Barnett argued that the one black man on the original jury resembled donovan too much to be included. What a racist! He thinks all blacks look alike? What a nazi! To think that a retrial is only important because of not burning a house down is so 20 century. You nazi fucks need to come to the realization that jeremy morse crossed the supposed line. He beat a handcuffed 16 year old defenseless child! He was not a danger to these pigs he was a 100 pound child. Jeremy morse is about 220#. WTF? You harping on me and my situation is so funny to me. I am going places and doing whatever the fuck I want. Don't be jealous cause in inglewood you will not get 5 white jurors who will refuse to convict jeremy morse cause of 912. Fuck You. You nazi racist people are so fuckin hilarious to defend such a coward! What's next Ok' in a priest to fuck little children? You fuckin nazi's are powerless http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/Personal22.html you have NO control. Jeremy morse is the one on trial not me.

The LADA might be overmatched (on purpose) by barnett but. not Johnny cochran and milton grimes. Oh yeah jeremy can't afford barnett for that. His mother lori pettit of torrance had to sell her home in Seattle just to pay for her nazi sons mistakes. Boo fuckin hoo. Jeremy morse will be broke and will have to hide in his home forever. I on the other hand have a lawsuit against the LADA and the media that will set me up for life. I have no worries. I am not a criminal. I have turned the corner and jeremy morse is just beginning to have his life turned around.

So to all those who support police no matter what (including the 5 old white jurors) who think that a cop can do no wrong, I say FUCK YOU. You mean shit to me.

You ain't seen nothing yet pigs.

Sincerely,

Mitchell Crooks

PS. Your assumption that donovan was a violent subject is based merely on your hatred towards blacks and young america. You do not know donovan jackson and you do not know what happened before I arrived (yet). You are truly ignorant and hate-mongers. People like you make me so happy I Came forward. The world laughs at you. I really could care less about you or your chickenshit army occupying OUR streets.

http://www.stolenlives.org/
http://www.copwatch.com/
http://refuseandresist.org/
http://www.geocities.com/capa_dfp2001/
http://live.axisofjustice.sparkart.net/
www.noreversal.com
FOR A GOOD LAUGH
http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/Menu1.html
ARTISTIC VERSION IN INGLEWOOD
http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/iMovieTheater11.html
MY WELCOMING BACK TO LA BY SOUTH CENTRAL
http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/iMovieTheater9.html
OCT 22 2003 MARCH AGAINST POLICE TERROR
http://homepage.mac.com/encyte/Personal22.html

Look for the instructions for the "precision drop" demolition of #7 World Trade Center, the U.S. Secret Serv ice Headquarters Building, in the ending scenes from Universal Studio's Volcano film (the one starriing Anne Heche and Tommie Lee Jones). Un iversal's Volcano calls for the demolition of a "tower of glass and steel" and shows precisely how that would bed done.

What is the significance? The l ink between Edgar Bronfman, Jr., head of the film division and owner of Universal and certain allegations linking him to the assassination of John F. Kennedy (Jack Ruby worked for Bronfman, as did Richard Nixon who headed the CIA's death squad). Bronfman stole the script from a Federal witness, altered the ending, and then invited the witness for a dinner at Windows on the World, the restaurant at the top of the Trade Center on the evening of September 10, 2001. When the witness never showed, the invitation was repeated the next morning.

Also invited was former President Bill Clinton, whose wife suspected he had returned early from his visit to Australia, and was meeting with a woman!

Go figure.